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Quote# 11589

1) If Evolution is true then how do you account for Mental Faculties? Atoms banging against one another in randon fasion do not seem to make much since as to how our mental faculties can be reliable. You are stuck with Darwin's Doubt. I find this as a flaw in Atheistic Materialism.
2) Hell is not unjust. Biblical Christianity says that man is fallen. We are born bad so to speak, that is why we need the Grace of Christ. So it is not unjust for God to send us to hell. I would also ask the question: Who are you to talk back to God?

Blake Reas, TheologyWeb.com 44 Comments [5/11/2006 12:00:00 AM]
Fundie Index: 4
Submitted By: Talisman
WTF?! || meh
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Hadanelith

1) what? reparse, please.
2) Hell is unjust because it is an infinite punishment for a finite crime. In answer to your question: I am a sentient, autonomous being; a far cry from God, who is an imaginary being contrived from the minds of other sentient autonomous beings like myself.

5/11/2006 11:36:48 PM

ryan

Who I am to talk back to God? I am ryan. Oh yeah and I have been proven to exist so Me 1 God 0

5/11/2006 11:42:48 PM

Nick

Proof that Christianity is misanthropic.

5/11/2006 11:44:38 PM

Napoleon the Clown

1. You fail! Repeat the class!
2. Soooo.... How is it just for us to be automatically fucked for something we didn't even do?

5/11/2006 11:49:13 PM

Nick

Napoleon, because might makes right! They, like, rhyme and everything!

5/11/2006 11:53:46 PM

Amos

And I thought Plantinga's arguments couldn't get any more absurd... We now have his evolutionary argument against naturalism in barely lucid form.

5/12/2006 12:15:21 AM

godling

1)Your Mental Faculties seem to be banging around in 'randon fasion' right now.
2)Every fundy who tries to explain away the problem of evil and the injustice of hell only manages to make their god more monstrous.

5/12/2006 12:16:55 AM

Papabear

\"1) If Evolution is true then how do you account for Mental Faculties?\"

Intelligence evolves just as any other trait. If it enhances the number of a species that survive through their reproductive period and/or increases the number of offspring, that trait tends to predominate.

\"Atoms banging against one another in randon fasion do not seem to make much since as to how our mental faculties can be reliable. You are stuck with Darwin's Doubt. I find this as a flaw in Atheistic Materialism.\"

You inept sentence construction has jammed my Fundie to English translator.


\"2) Hell is not unjust.\"

Yes, it is. No matter how much you really, really wish it was just, it isn't. Eternal punishment for the slightest crime is unjust, period.


\"Biblical Christianity\"

As opposed to what? \"Chilton's handbook Christianity?\" \"Pets on Parade Christianity?\" \"Cabbage Patch Doll Christianity?\"


\"says that man is fallen. We are born bad so to speak, that is why we need the Grace of Christ.\"

I was not \"born bad.\"


\"So it is not unjust for God to send us to hell.\"

But \"Biblical Christianity\" says God, the omnipotent, omniscient, omni-benevolent, good and loving, perfect God, created us. If created by a perfect being, we would be perfect as a perfect being could not create imperfection without being imperfect himself. If we were perfect, then we could do no imperfect thing yourselves, therefore,there could have been no fall. If there was no fall, there is no need for a savior. Poof! Bye bye Christianity.


\"I would also ask the question: Who are you to talk back to God?\"

Who is God, but your imaginary friend? I do not talk to imaginary beings.

5/12/2006 12:24:10 AM

Nick

What he means by point #1 is that if our mind is material, evolved, and imperfect, we have no reason to think its conclusions mean anything.

I think this argument may be accurate in his case.

5/12/2006 12:50:01 AM

Nick

What he means by point #1 is that if our mind is material, evolved, and imperfect, we have no reason to think its conclusions mean anything.

I think this argument may be accurate in his case.

5/12/2006 12:51:37 AM

Nick

What he means by point #1 is that if our mind is material, evolved, and imperfect, we have no reason to think its conclusions mean anything.

I think this argument may be accurate in his case.

5/12/2006 12:52:09 AM

Crosis

<<< Atoms banging against one another in randon fasion do not seem to make much since as to how our mental faculties can be reliable. >>>

That would be because their interaction is not random.

<<< Hell is not unjust. >>>

Infinite punishment for finite crimes is infinitely unjust, as others have said.

5/12/2006 12:57:19 AM

Babbleon

\"Who are you to talk back to God?\"

This question implies that God spoke to me first. He hasn't.

5/12/2006 1:21:21 AM

CousinTed

Whe I listen to you Blake, I can't help but feel there are no mental faculties to account for.

5/12/2006 4:11:32 AM

Julian

Give up!

Go away!

Shut up!

5/12/2006 4:23:17 AM

Maronan

What a mess. I hope I don't get my paws dirty trying to get through this thing. Oh well.
Originally posted by Papabear

You inept sentence construction has jammed my Fundie to English translator.
Fortunately, I've got my Acme Translator. (I'm an Acme employee, so I get a free translator!)

[Acme Translator is starting up.]
Machine translations are imperfect. Single-tired-person translations may be equally flawed. Fundiebabble-to-English translator now engaged.

Translation:
1.) I can't imagine how evolution could explain the development of mental faculties. Atoms banging together randomly can't create a reliable brain. I am under the impression that atheists belive atoms bang together randomly without any predictable patterns (like laws of physics), so I think this is a problem with atheism.
2) I believe that God made us horrible, and is prepared to torture us for being the way we made him. But I must also believe that God is just, because an ancient book of myths says so. Therefore, I have come with the idea that it is just to torture someone for being bad even though you forced them to be bad, and I will force myself to accept this contorted rationalization. I will also try and suppress your outrage by telling you to shut up and not question the authority that is allegedly preparing to torture you.


Why is it that fundies always try and rationalize hell? If hell were real, this would make them far worse than the rape apologists. Obviously, none of them want to admit that their god is horrible, and few are rational enough to give up the \"god\" idea entirely, but there are plenty of Christians who have abandoned the idea of \"hell\" and torture therein. It isn't even in the Bible!

Of course, there's one other thing to consider. Fundies like this think hell is real. If hell were real, and everyone knew that hell and the associated omnipotent god were real, few would think that it's \"just.\" Most would rightly consider it horrible. Would they act that way? Likely not. If the fundie hell and god were real, everyone would be kissing that god's ass in an attempt to avoid hell; if you can't fight a dictator and you can't escape from that dictator, the only thing to do is to get on his good side, right? Hence, we'd see a lot of people claiming that hell is \"just.\" Only people who know that hell is not real would openly say that it would be wrong if it were real.

EDIT: The nameless quote tag seems to have added a \"wrote:\" to the end of the translation. Meh.

5/12/2006 6:35:03 AM

Bone_Vulture

Oh man, the source thread is insane. Seriously.

5/12/2006 6:37:29 AM

Luffy

Who are you to talk back to Stalin/der Fuhrer/Il Duce/King George/the Pharaoh/the Roman emperor/etc.?

5/12/2006 11:10:29 AM

TDR

ryan, you rock.

5/12/2006 4:06:19 PM

kmisho

The only way hell cannot be unjust is if there are infinite crimes, such as if I were capable of killing an infinite number of people. Then it COULD be just for me to receive infinite punishment. Otherwise, infinite punishment for finite crimes means the punishment does not fit the crime, which is unjust.

5/12/2006 4:44:08 PM

kmisho

part 1) GOD OF THE GAPS

I don't understand, therefore god did it.

5/12/2006 4:45:03 PM

Jacob Syne

I am God's ombudsman. He hired me to remind him he doesn't exist when he gets too cocky.

5/12/2006 4:47:04 PM

Nezu Chiza

How people can respect a religion that starts off with the idea that everyone is born bad and has to pay for past sins unrelated to them I just can't understand. Well, I can actually understand from a cult standpoint, but not from a logical one. As a cult, religion needs a way to scare people into joining, and original sin tends to do that. Even if it's STUPID :P

5/12/2006 5:33:03 PM

awhell

who am i to talk back to a ficticous desert god??

A FREE-THINKING HUMAN BEING


BURN ME AT THE STAKE

5/12/2006 7:51:54 PM

Talisman

Originally posted by awhell

BURN ME AT THE STAKE


If they had their way they probably would.

5/12/2006 8:10:50 PM
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