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Quote# 11604

I heard an interesting analogy once...

Let's say you are in a movie theater watching a movie with a few hundred people and an armed felon stands up threatening to kill everyone in the theater. Before he begins the executions, a father walks up to the felon with his only son and makes a deal. He asks the felon to take and kill his only son in place of all the people in the theater. The felon agrees. Many grateful people rush toward the door of freedom. However, a few of the people in the theater come forward to tell the father that his deal is unfair. They would like him to provide another way of getting out of the theater alive.

That's it. I found it helpful when discussing the fairness of salvation.

G-d Seeker, Rapture Ready 43 Comments [5/12/2006 12:00:00 AM]
Fundie Index: 4
Submitted By: Alejandro
WTF?! || meh
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shell

Except in Xianity's case the father is also the felon.

5/12/2006 6:57:47 PM

Deus Ex Machina

Nor have I ever seen the felon, the son or the father, so if it's all the same to you I'll just keep watching the movie...

5/12/2006 7:06:43 PM

Talisman

\"He asks the felon to take and kill his only son in place of all the people in the theater. The felon agrees.\"

And the felon would agree to this why exactly? Perhaps you meant \"mentally deranged psychotic\" rather than felon.

\"However, a few of the people in the theater come forward to tell the father that his deal is unfair.\"

More likely they would be scratching their heads at the blatant insanity of it. If the father is so keen on a substitutionary sacrifice the only moral thing to do would be to offer himself rather than his son.

5/12/2006 7:11:02 PM

Babbleon

OK, G-d Seeker, try this one:

Let's say you are in a movie theater watching a movie with a few hundred people. A man stands up and yells out that there is an armed felon in the corner threatening to kill everyone in the theater. You look in the corner, but no one is there. The man then yells that the felon had his own son killed, and will kill you, too, if you don't believe in him. About then the police burst in and drag away the interruptor. You go back to watching the movie.

(Sorry Alejandro)

5/12/2006 7:14:55 PM

Alejandro

Hey! I submitted the quote, but didn't write it! I demand an apology -this is the worst thing I have ever been accused of in all my life!


;-)

5/12/2006 7:32:58 PM

Papabear

\"I heard an interesting analogy once...\"

Just once? You should try to listen more.


\"Let's say you are in a movie theater watching a movie with a few hundred people and an armed felon stands up threatening to kill everyone in the theater. Before he begins the executions, a father walks up to the felon with his only son and makes a deal. He asks the felon to take and kill his only son in place of all the people in the theater. The felon agrees. Many grateful people rush toward the door of freedom. However, a few of the people in the theater come forward to tell the father that his deal is unfair.\"

It IS unfair. The son got a truly raw deal. Plus, you make no mention of the criminal being punished.


\"They would like him to provide another way of getting out of the theater alive.\"

No, they would like to find a way out of the theater that doesn't involve killing the innocent.


\"That's it. I found it helpful when discussing the fairness of salvation.\"

No, that is not it. In your analogy the father is not omnipotent. God, being omnipotent, should have been able to find a way out of the sin and damnation he allowed that didn't involve killing the innocent.

Remember what is says in the babble:
Book of God 3:16 from the BFD translation says \"For I so loved the world that I gave my only begotten self, to myself, to appease my own anger at my own creation, that whosoever believeth in me should not escape me, but be forced to live with me forever.\"

5/12/2006 7:46:33 PM

TDR

you found it helpful? Are you simple or something?

5/12/2006 7:49:16 PM

NotMe

I think that the father would get a kick to his head by some. You don't go around sacrificing your son to get out.
If you can manage top walk up to the killer without being shot you can run for the exit and get out of there.

I pity the son if he was really to be sacrificed. The father deserves to be shot for trying to look good at the cost of others.

5/12/2006 8:16:36 PM

McCulloch

Should be nominated for \"least helpful analogy\"
He also forgot to relate that the father in the theater provided the ammo to the felon, that the father was also the son and could not be killed (for long anyways). Oh, and the felon is allowed to kill all those who remain in the theater, with the father's blessing.

5/12/2006 8:18:07 PM

JohnRaptor

How about this one: An armed fellon stands up in the middle of a crowded theater and threaten's to kill everyone. So everyone jumps him. The fellon, though armed, is grossly outnumbered and quickly subdued. They beat the crap out of him and go back to their movie.

5/12/2006 8:51:06 PM

Crosis

\"Second Least Helpful Analogy\" award?

There are so many things wrong with this I don't know where to start. You guys covered it pretty well.

5/12/2006 8:56:20 PM

Jax

300 people? What kind of gun does this felon have? He can't kill everyone, he'd run out of ammo, at which time other movie goers would beat him down, possibly killing him.

5/12/2006 9:08:47 PM

Sierra

People you love
Will turn their backs on you
You'll lose your hair
Your teeth
Your knife will fall out of its sheath
But you still don't like to leave before the end of the movie
People you hate will get their hooks into you
They'll pull you down
You'll frown
They'll tar you and drag you through town
But you still don't like to leave before the end of the movie
No you still don't like to leave before the end of the show

-Cake, \"End of the Movie\"

Kinda eerie.

5/12/2006 9:10:30 PM

Jacob Syne

Let's say you are in a movie theater watching a movie with a few hundred people and an armed felon stands up threatening to kill everyone in the theater.

Wouldn't you want to find someone who's already seen the movie to tell you the ending?

5/12/2006 9:46:42 PM

Gerard

OH REEEEEALLY, you found that helpfull?
If that is helpfull the Christian Salvation story is in big trouble!

5/12/2006 9:52:07 PM

Huffers

God is a psycho killer?

5/12/2006 10:00:20 PM

Babar

God is always a bad guy in these scenarios. For once I'd like him to be an ice cream man giving away free ice cream or something.

5/12/2006 11:24:10 PM

whitewater55

Anology neither helful or interesting. How can so many people be sooooo fucked up? I know, it's that flouride in the water, yeah, that's the ticket.

5/13/2006 12:00:17 AM

Puistokemisti

Originally posted by Huffers

God is a psycho killer?

This shouldn't come as suprise to anyone who has opened OT

5/13/2006 12:00:25 AM

Julian

\"That's it. I found it helpful when discussing the fairness of salvation.\"

That's OK, we all knew there wasn't any - thanks for making it abundantly clear though!

5/13/2006 12:24:39 AM

Amos

Originally posted by Jax

300 people? What kind of gun does this felon have?


BFG-9000, I would suppose.

5/13/2006 12:27:21 AM

JadedRevenge

What sort of father sacrifices his son in a talked deal? The grateful people run off? They are most likely thinking 'lunatic. its your problem now mate'

what about the people who try to tackle the sycho (the armed one) to the ground while hes talking with the brave man putting his son on the line?

that the 'heoric' thing to do, putting your OWN life at risk, not some kids

5/13/2006 2:24:30 AM

Aesmael

Originally posted by TDR

you found it helpful? Are you simple or something?


TDR wins.

Too bad G-d Seeker left out the part where the father knew felon for years and years, was the one who got the felon to pull this stunt in the first place and had raised his son specifically to have him killed like this.

5/13/2006 3:24:36 AM

ssdexecutor

Originally posted by Aesmael

Too bad G-d Seeker left out the part where the father knew felon for years and years, was the one who got the felon to pull this stunt in the first place and had raised his son specifically to have him killed like this.

Don't forget that the father used to employ the felon.

5/13/2006 7:54:38 AM

Napoleon the Clown

Don't forget the father is responsible for the felon going over the edge, having the ammo to do this, and locked to doors before the felon made his little announcement.

5/13/2006 8:18:19 AM
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