Quote# 13132

[When asked why God does not use his powers to open all people up to Jesus]

The reason is not known to me, but I would say that the element of coercion to get someone or something to love you devalues the worth of love itself.

kristiangrrl, Livejournal 34 Comments [7/18/2006 12:00:00 AM]
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wot - like stories of heaven and hell?

7/19/2006 4:06:39 AM


I wouldn't call this one \"fundie\", so much as \"short sighted\" for forgetting about the core principles of salvation and eternal punishment.

If someone genuinely believes that their punishment for being an unbeliever is getting tortured, they have no other rational alternatives and cannot be making their own decision at all.

7/19/2006 4:11:25 AM


Is there any part of Christian doctrine that doesn't include coercion?

7/19/2006 4:54:21 AM


But the killing you if you don't believe part or the eternal damnation for asking for some proof is completely and utterly not coercion?

As for the fundieness of it... eh. Not the most fundiestic thing. I'm going to agree with the short sighted comment.

7/19/2006 4:58:19 AM

Napoleon the Clown

I think you've missed what's wrong with what you just said...

7/19/2006 5:03:50 AM


While it is true that you can't make someone love you, I've had my best luck in love when I didn't commit genocide or send people to eternal torment.

7/19/2006 5:25:00 AM


finger on jist, that grrl.

7/19/2006 5:26:39 AM


How about god just shows that he actually exists? That wouldn't be coercion, it would merely be proof but he can't seem to do that. I would imagine that it would be much more devaluing to a worshipper's love to have no justification for a lifetime of adoration. But I'm kooky like that, I actually need something to base faith on or else I could end up believing every crazy, unprovable story that comes along. And that wouldn't be very smart.

7/19/2006 5:43:57 AM


\"By Jove!\" award

7/19/2006 5:51:16 AM


Remember this the next time you get in someone's face.

7/19/2006 7:50:46 AM


tbh I don't think this is particularly fundie.

7/19/2006 8:29:03 AM


Ding! We have a winner! Now, HOLD ONTO THAT THOUGHT! PLEASE!

7/19/2006 10:16:35 AM


I'd still recommend the \"Delicious Irony\" award.

7/19/2006 11:09:26 AM


I'll second \"Delicious Irony\" and throw in a copy of the old testiment and a mirror, clearly the poor grrl hasn't come across either in a while.

7/19/2006 11:24:16 AM


Ya know, that statement actually makes sense to me. LOL

7/19/2006 12:20:05 PM

David D.G.

I agree with the \"short sighted\" comment; the irony is present here, but it's not particularly entertainingly presented.

~David D.G.

7/19/2006 2:27:05 PM

Oolon Coluphid

I'd imagine it's got something to do with the fact that Jesus has been dead for close to 2000 years.

7/19/2006 2:55:00 PM


Thirding \"Delicious Irony\"

7/19/2006 4:01:25 PM

Star Cluster

I'm with you, Redhunter. I liken this to someone who's father is not present in their live, but the mother keeps telling the child that he is away on business or for whatever reason, and will return someday. Time goes on and on, but no father ever shows up. The father never calls, writes, or indicates in any way that we is alive, but the mother insists that he is and she talks to him often. How long will it be before the child no longer believes that the father exists? If the father would only show up and prove to the child that he was his/her father, the child would not be coerced into loving him, but then the child would have a better basis for any love so given. Prove of existence is not coercion, obedience for fear of punishment is.

7/19/2006 5:26:56 PM


That's actually a pretty logical statement, in itself. It's a decent answer to why God doesn't \"force\" people to love him. However, in this case, there's also the fact that anyone who doesn't love this God is damned for all eternity, so it's pretty selfish of God to let people that may change their mind about him be damned.

7/19/2006 7:01:36 PM


I agree with this statement, but it doesn't really apply to a god. Coercing someone to love you destroys the the core principle behind love.

7/19/2006 8:17:05 PM


So the threat of Brimstone, Hell fire & eternal damnation isn't catagorized as coercion? Than what the hell is?

7/19/2006 9:50:26 PM


I don't see this as fundie. Frankly, I think she makes a good point.

7/19/2006 10:43:58 PM


While I agree this is't really that fundy, you shouldn't try to back it up with Pascal's Wager like so many of you are...

7/20/2006 12:57:17 AM


But lobbing anyone who doesn't think the right way into the lake of fire shows true, real love.

10/14/2007 12:29:20 AM

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