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#70637
Skaloop
Quick! Engage the infinite improbability drive!
8/31/2006 4:30:34 AM
#70638
Hadanelith
No. If there is any chance whatsoever, then, poof, there's a chance. There is never a certainty, nor is there ever a total uncertainty. There are no guarantees. As for deities, there is no chance at all. Not one in infinity, but literally zero. As such, no deity can exist, regardless of many universes.
8/31/2006 4:31:08 AM
#70642
Patches
Here, try this:
Throw a ball. There are infinite exact places where it could land. By your reasoning, since the ball has a one-in-infinity chance of landing any particular place, the ball will never land.
8/31/2006 4:42:36 AM
#70645
DoctorX
By that logic the universe can't exist because there's an infinite number of parallel universes in which there is a chance of someone developing a multiverse-destroying bomb.
8/31/2006 5:00:48 AM
#70647
Amos
Originally posted by DoctorX
By that logic the universe can't exist because there's an infinite number of parallel universes in which there is a chance of someone developing a multiverse-destroying bomb.
Which reminds me of Tenchi, an anime in which Washu (an old not-quite-evil genius who gave herself the body of a 13-year-old) is said to have developed a machine gun that fires universe-destroying bullets.
That has always been my favorite example of overkill.
8/31/2006 5:10:08 AM
#70651
Napoleon the Clown
Originally posted by Patches
Here, try this:
Throw a ball. There are infinite exact places where it could land. By your reasoning, since the ball has a one-in-infinity chance of landing any particular place, the ball will never land.
Ah, but there is also the possibility the ball will not come down as well, so it cannot do that. And there's also a possibility it will coninue to exist. That means it would have to stop existing, but even that has a chance of occurring. Paradoxes rock, no?
8/31/2006 5:22:45 AM
#70656
Theironpaperclip
Have you ever heard of the 0 property? It states that any number multiplied by 0 = 0. That number could even be infinite.
8/31/2006 5:31:19 AM
#70660
Mary Sunshine
HAH??
8/31/2006 5:45:24 AM
#70667
Catbert18
It must be the \"new math\" they're using.
8/31/2006 6:00:36 AM
#70674
Redhunter
\"if there are, in fact, infinite universes (and there very well might be) then that GUARANTEES there's a God out there.\"
Since this is the only part that makes sense to me, please explain how this is so.
8/31/2006 6:28:05 AM
#70675
NotMe
Originally posted by \"
Here, try this:
Throw a ball. There are infinite exact places where it could land. By your reasoning, since the ball has a one-in-infinity chance of landing any particular place, the ball will never land.
That is not what he is saying. he is saying that in an infinite number of tries you'll get an infinite number of results. And at least one of those results will be what you needed it to be, the existence of a god in this case.
In other words, if you trow the ball an infinite number of times, it will land on all the possible places.
8/31/2006 6:36:28 AM
#70691
Julian
Well the most obvious problem with your theory is - apart from there being no evidence of multiple universes, the probability of \"God\" existing in this particular one of 'infinte' universes is 0.
The really bad news udsana, is in this particular universe, I happen to be your God, and I am most displeased with your stupidity. Hurl yourself forthwith into the nearest volcano so as to appease my anger.
8/31/2006 8:32:37 AM
#70704
AWP
Drugs are bad oke....
8/31/2006 10:56:35 AM
#70717
Mister Spak
\"And if there are, in fact, infinite universes (and there very well might be) then that GUARANTEES there's a God out there.\"
Actually it guarantees there are an infinite number of gods, thus creating a new type of religion - infinitheism.
8/31/2006 12:05:55 PM
#70719
Ens
infinity * 0 = indeterminate.
This is NOT the same thing as > 0.
EDIT TO ADD:
Theironpaperclip: I think it is reasonable to formulate his ideas as limiting to infinity and zero simultaneously. His 1/infinity nonsense certainly suggests it. Nevertheless, in truly absolute terms, you are correct.
Julian: To play Devil's ironic advocate, if there were a God in any of these universes, then his all-powerfulness should be able to cross him over into our universe.
Mr. Spak: Well, only if he had a finite nonzero probability to begin with. But although it's confusingly worded, I think he's admitting an infinitesimal probability.
There's also the philosophical argument that there is no meaningful difference between 2 Gods (in the Christian omnimax sense) and 1 God. An infinity of Gods is the same thing as one God that encompasses the entire infinity.
*brain explodes*
8/31/2006 12:15:25 PM
#70732
Sandman
Wow, some major logical problems and assumptions here.
The biggest problem is the fact that they seem to think that infinity is a number. It isn't. It's a concept. You can't actually make infinity work in a logical fashion in equations.
The second is the problem that they use a \"might\" statement to prove a \"guarantee\" concept.
8/31/2006 1:00:22 PM
#70740
Mister Spak
I agree. Udsuna seems to think infinity means a very large number that allows extremely improbable events to happen by chance.
8/31/2006 1:16:27 PM
#70766
Amos
Originally posted by Sandman
You can't actually make infinity work in a logical fashion in equations.
Well, with hyperreal and surreal numbers you can manipulate infinities and infinitesimals algebraically and mix them with regular numbers. In fact, hyperreals are the foundation of an equivalent, but non-standard, approach to calculus. Of course, these still don't support what Udsuna is trying to do.
8/31/2006 2:50:24 PM
#70794
Randola
Usually fundies COMPLAIN about random chance, but now god is a result of random chance?
8/31/2006 3:56:53 PM
#70832
jay
It would take an infinity of time just to figure out what he/she is saying!
8/31/2006 4:50:14 PM
#70871
Austin
What is he SAYING!?!?!?!?!?!?
8/31/2006 5:50:00 PM
#70905
TDR
\"infinite\"
you keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
8/31/2006 7:21:09 PM
#70909
CousinTed
udsuna, you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. Please shut up.
8/31/2006 7:39:59 PM
#70942
Babbleon
Wow, quantum mechanics spawns a deity. Credit where credit's due, this is one of the best explanations of the origin of a god I've heard in a while. But then, that's not saying much here.
Most of the arguments have been covered -- the main one in my opinion is that you first must assume such a being could exist.
But there's also this: If a universe produced the god, then the god couldn't have created the universe (or multiverse). Therefore, this god can't be the Judeo-Christian God.
8/31/2006 9:27:09 PM
#71078
Julian
Originally posted by Ens Originally posted by Julian
Well the most obvious problem with your theory is - apart from there being no evidence of multiple universes, the probability of \"God\" existing in this particular one of 'infinite' universes is 0.
Julian: To play Devil's ironic advocate, if there were a God in any of these universes, then his all-powerfulness should be able to cross him over into our universe.
Ah, what a cute derivation. Violates everything we know about the universe, but hey, that aside...
So, in an infinite number of universes (which cannot exist), not only would God exist, but so would an anti-God that would completely destroy God.
9/1/2006 12:05:48 PM
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