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#345474
inmate22841
How very American. Apparently all history begins with the Mayflower.
11/27/2007 5:56:20 AM
#345475
anevilmeme
Laws against stealing, murder, adultry, and perjury appear in non-Christian as well as Christian societies.
As far as religious freedom having its basis in Christianity: Bwhahahahahaahahahahaahaha!!!!!
11/27/2007 6:00:04 AM
#345477
szena
The early settlers were Christian (they came from a country in which being Christian was essentially required) and sometimes used Christian language in their writings. That does not in any way mean that all institutions were founded with the intent of furthering Christianity.
11/27/2007 6:06:28 AM
#345490
AWP
Lies and damned lies.
11/27/2007 6:38:36 AM
#345491
Redhunter
How IS the weather up your own ass?
11/27/2007 6:40:42 AM
#345494
Laurel
Gun rights? I don't recall Jesus having anything to say about those.
11/27/2007 6:46:25 AM
#345500
MK
Actually, the first universities were founded not to promote Christianity, but to preserve knowledge and keep it within the church's control.
11/27/2007 6:58:32 AM
#345501
Happymealungen
Yes, I remember the good ole' times before Jeebus when murder was perfectly acceptable.
11/27/2007 6:58:54 AM
#345502
Mister Spak
"Laws against stealing, murder, adultry, perjury, all had their basis in Christianity."
Code of Hammurabi, dumbass.
"Laws protecting private property, gun rights, privacy, and religious freedom, had their basis in Christianity."
The constitution was written to keep christianity out of the government. You fail.
11/27/2007 6:59:08 AM
#345505
Caustic Gnostic
World history ends with first-century occupied Palestine.
American history begins with fundies who were not welcome anywhere in Europe.
"Selective History" tends to suppress reality, and those who engage in it, are not to be trusted.
IOW, fail.
11/27/2007 7:06:08 AM
#345517
James
"Laws against stealing, murder, adultry, perjury, all had their basis in Christianity."
Wrong. The code of Hammurabi predates your bible.
"Laws protecting private property, gun rights, privacy, and religious freedom, had their basis in Christianity."
None of those things are in the bible at all except private property, and Rome had a well developed property law before Christianity came along.
11/27/2007 7:20:37 AM
#345546
Nope, they were not "proselitising", because, if you were not a Christian BEFORE you entered, you could not apply. Learn the meaning of the words before using them. And, by the way, Bologna existed in the tweflth century already, like 400 centuries at least, before the Mayflower. Concerning the laws, man, EVERY CIVILISATION HAS A LAW AGAINST THOSE CRIMES(except adultery, which is not a crime anymore). And laws concerning property, privacy and religious freedom were NOT CONTEMPLATED IN THE MAYFLOWER COLONY(The scarlett letter rings you a bell?). And the right to own guns is OPPOSITE to Christianity and almost exclusive to USA because it was a country which sprang from a revolution.
11/27/2007 7:59:04 AM
#345557
stealing, murder, adultery, and perjury are considered wrong in all societies. that's not unique to christianity. early christians were also not into private property or gun rights. they were non-violent and believed in sharing among themselves so that everyone would be cared for. you can still see that in the mennonite, and amish communities today.
11/27/2007 8:28:35 AM
#345559
cyborgtroy
And the Greeks had statues and buildings before we did, but it doesn't mean we have to worship Zeus.
11/27/2007 8:31:10 AM
#345564
NonProphet
I've been looking through this bible, and I'm not finding a single verse that looks anything like a law regarding privacy, religious freedom, or gun rights.
Something tells me Old_Trapper is just pulling arguments out of his ass.
11/27/2007 8:41:40 AM
#345567
Blackvoice
*mighty headdesk*
11/27/2007 8:46:06 AM
#345568
John
Laws against stealing, murder and perjury, and laws protecting private property all have existed in every civilization, including the Romans, Greeks, Egyptians and Chinese, none of whom were Christian. There is no law against adultery. The only effect Christianity had on religious freedom was negative: to show people what a lousy idea it is when religion sticks its nose into the law. And gun rights? WTF?
11/27/2007 9:03:43 AM
#345569
Garfield
Christianity doesn't own common morals and common sense!
Even in old egypt people had laws against murder and theft and such.
Not everybody needs heavenly motivation to do the right thing! Some of us just do because they are decent people!
11/27/2007 9:04:04 AM
#345570
Michael
Fail. Hammurabi's Law predates Christianity by centuries.
11/27/2007 9:05:19 AM
#345584
Rhys
I agree with Blackvoice.
This guy owes me a new keyboard.
Also, my forehead hurts now.
11/27/2007 9:30:46 AM
#345585
Caustic Gnostic
Social contract.
When early (stone age) humans realized that working as a group was more efficient than doing everything solo, the necessity for social contract, and the language to express it, arose. This is a very basic human thing, which may be regarded as instinctual.
Hammurabi codified the concept in terms that applied to all conceivable (at the time) misdeeds. This is the earliest known manifestation of a set of "laws". It helped enormously that those laws were chiseled in stone. Hammurabi's stele specified penalties for infractions, thus (perhaps) originating the concept of crime and punishment, as opposed to simple revenge.
Judaism came later. They didn't reinvent the Cosmos, but appropriated whatever law, and myth, that worked within their context.
Jesus was probably quite aware of the Socratic school of thought, as he interpreted the social contract concept in a simple and populist way. (Too bad his total break from Judaism was thwarted.)
To put it quite simply, Old_Trapper, if you seriously believe the bible is the Alpha and Omega, you are mistaken. Get an education.
11/27/2007 9:33:27 AM
#345606
Osiris
Religious freedom is not a Christian idea.
11/27/2007 10:22:04 AM
#345611
LabRat
well, I guess home schoolers don't even teach the meaning of the word "history" much less make minimal effort at teaching it.
11/27/2007 10:29:21 AM
#345649
Samuel Colt
Gun rights?
Religious freedom?
What?
11/27/2007 12:15:30 PM
#345655
Heaping Bowlful
1. First Commandment
2. First Amendment
These are mutually exclusive. Our laws are not based exclusively on "christian values" and never have been.
11/27/2007 12:21:55 PM
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