"Animals were created for man in the beginning. All creatures have amazing instincts, including dogs, who can "feel" and interact with their owner. But this is not the moral law written on their hearts. Only man was given that. One proof is that every ancient civilization has a legal code that is similiar to God's moral law. Yet, animals do not have a judicial system to mete out justice."
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Moral Code of Dog: If thou touchest the food of another dog, that dog shall verily rip thy throat out.
Moral Code of Cat: Thou art subservient to me and all mine needs.
Moral Code of Mosquito: bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Animals do not -need- "a judicial system to mete out justice" for the simple reason that they, unlike humans, do not go out of their way to injure, oppress or otherwise abuse their fellow animals. (at least, not within their own species.)
They also do not create religions and deities to explain things they do not or cannot understand.
Could you please demonstrate this amazing instinct in tigers, Lions or Grizzly bears?
After all, according to you, they were also created for man ;)
One proof is that every ancient civilization has a legal code that is similiar to God's moral law.
Or alternatively, one proof that man invented "God's" laws is that God's moral law is similar to every ancient civilization's legal code.
"One proof is that every ancient civilization has a legal code that is similiar to God's moral law"
All civilisations have drastically different legal codes, and nothing which predates modern religions be identifiably tied to their doctrines. What IS consistent is a cause-effect type morality- restitution for harm caused; avoidance of harm to another; right to possess ones property.
You've neatly demonstrated that humanity's innate concept of morality is essentially Humanism.
Oh really, another one of those assholes trying to dictate whether animals have souls or not, well wiseass, consider this: If animals dont have souls, why does the human pop keep increasing, and the animal pop decreasing? @ poster above, my ferret can read, i caught him looking over a book of mine. As for moral, animals dont nuke each other over religion. Now if you excuse me, i have some live mice to kill, because, well im hungry and the mice dont mind.
Yes, humans have a common morality. But, ever occur to you that God does not have to factor into that equation? I know...I know...I just exploded your brain. But, hopefully, there is still enough left of it for me to hear you babble incoherently in protest to the idea that yes, in fact, animals do have something that resembles "morality" (whatever that means outside of human societies).
"Yet, animals do not have a judicial system to mete out justice."
Obviously then you've never seen a wolf pack hand out justice for infractions of their social order. Or hyenas. Or lions. Or apes. Or any other creature with an intricate social structure.
"One proof is that every ancient civilization has a legal code that is similiar to God's moral law."
So, you admit that equally good standards of justice were developed by societies completely ignorant of you God, eh?
One proof is that every ancient civilization has a legal code that is similiar to God's moral law.
Or maybe it's that those laws originated first, and then the people in charge assigned them to a deity in order to add more weight to them?
Yet, animals do not have a judicial system to mete out justice."
You don't know much about wolf packs, do you?
You would be surprised at the complexity of animal societies. You think animals live by some sort of "no law" state. Even the animals follow "herd mentality".
Amusingly one man's herd mentality is another man's law.
Animals don't have a judicial system, because judicial systems are a codification of moral laws, but they do not equate moral laws. Animals do have morals to a certain degree. Of course, shrimps or bacteria will have the lowest possible degree of morals, where as dogs or chimps will have a moral conscience pretty close to our own. It's all a matter of degree.
"Animals were created for man in the beginning.
- So you approve of bestiality! You amaze me.
All creatures have amazing instincts, including dogs, who can "feel" and interact with their owner. But this is not the moral law written on their hearts.
- Dogs do not read or write - even in their hearts.
Only man was given that.
- sadly even this does not of itself convey intelligence.
One proof is that every ancient civilization has a legal code that is similiar to God's moral law. Yet, animals do not have a judicial system to mete out justice."
- Agreed...and your point is?
Dogs were created by humans by domesticating wolves. Fox dogs have been made the same way and exhibit similar behavior to wolf dogs, when, a few generations earlier, they were ferocious foxes. Even their physical appearances change. Dogs (of either kind) learn the "feel" and interaction.
Dogs do have a moral law, it's called pack order. Although two dogs in the same pack will fight, the odds of them causing serious physical damage to each other is minimal. Wolves and lions hunt in a way that requires teamwork. In fact all social animals have some sort of justice system. It's just not as complex as humans. In the animal world, you step out of line, you get caught, you get punished immediately. No trial, no jury.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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