Quote# 41666

True_Blue's definition of a species for sexually reproducing organisms is a population of organisms that an interbreed successfully if the egg and sperm can combine in a petri dish to produce a healthy offspring. Thus, a poodle and a Great Dane are of the same species. Giraffes, zebras, and horses are of the same species. In fact, I would be entirely unsurprised if owls shared the same species as birds like pidgeons. By that definition, monkeys and people would be of different species.

True_Blue, www.christianforums.com 46 Comments [6/25/2008 3:13:03 PM]
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Submitted By: tigerdreams

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Science, ur doing it WRONG!

6/25/2008 3:15:37 PM

Paschal Wagner

Am I the only one who will now be living in constant fear of being attacked by a rabid girazehorse?

6/25/2008 3:18:27 PM

Anonymous Coward

"monkeys and people would be of different species"

Are you trying to prove something with this statement? Nobody says monkeys and humans are the same species.

6/25/2008 3:21:32 PM

Waiting for God

Possibly one of the most biologically ignorant things ever released onto the web, congratulations.

Your totally confused between 'breeds' and 'species'. The great Dane and a poodle are different breeds of the same species, they can reproduce, although I'm not sure which one would be the receiver.

Monkeys and Humans are indeed different species, didn't know anyone out there was trying to argue differently, so they cannot interbreed. However, they share a common ancestor, at some point there was no humans and no monkeys, only a species sharing similar traits with both, that over time, EVOLVED into two separate species.

God invented google, google can answer questions, use the fucking thing.

6/25/2008 3:30:00 PM



6/25/2008 3:37:41 PM


if I linked this guy the wiki article on "species" would his head asplode?

6/25/2008 3:38:53 PM


I have to disappoint you, True_Blue,
Giraffes have more in common with cows and pigs (all of them Ordo: Artiodactyla) than with horses (Ordo: Perissodactyla).

They are definitely too different to get offspring together ;)

You also won´t see owls (Ordo: Strigiformes) producing offspring with pigeons (Ordo: Columbiformes)

The animal kingdom is more differentiated into species (who cannot interbreed) than a christian fundamentalist (with his system of "kinds") might imagine ;)

6/25/2008 3:39:02 PM


This is not even internally consistent.

6/25/2008 3:45:35 PM


So, things as vastly different in appearance and taxonomy as pigeons and owls are the same species, but humans and monkeys can't possibly be.

6/25/2008 3:49:19 PM

jimmy-joe wimble

What's sad is when fundies think that evolution is something that really IS absurd and stupid, then reject it like any sensible well-informed person would, along with evolution itself. It's like people thinking that the fetal resemblance between species is interpreted by evolutionists as "the fetus re-enacting each phase of it's evolution", then "disproving" it and thinking they've discovered something. Sad, sad shit indeed.

6/25/2008 3:50:21 PM


You are doing it wrong.

6/25/2008 3:53:38 PM

David B.

Zebra hybrids are almost always sterile, hence wouldn't qualify as 'healthy offspring'. Giraffes and horses have different chromosome numbers and cannot interbreed.

Poodles and Great Danes are the same species (at the moment), but owls have between 2 and 4 more chromosomes than pigeons, so almost certainly are not (by TB's criteria).

The term "monkeys" covers a number of species of which humans are not one. This does not disprove their sharing a common ancestor.

A number of ring species (for example Ensatina salamanders) have the property that group A can be successfully interbred with B, and group B with C. By TB's definition this makes groups A, B and C all the same species. Group C, however, doesn't produce viable offspring with group A, hence is essentially a different species by that same definition.

So A is the same species as B, and B is the same species as C, but C and A are different species? TB's definition of 'species' is looking decidedly shaky!

Unless we accept that one species can (over time) become two, of course, then the above result makes perfect sense.

6/25/2008 4:01:24 PM

Allegory for Jesus

Interesting definition of species, in that your definition of "interbreed" just relies upon compatible sperm and ova, completely ignoring whether they are mechanically able to have sex in nature, and thus interbreed beyond human intervention. Being able to interbreed autonomously is pretty important to being an individual species, and is the impetus for evolutionary change.

6/25/2008 4:04:09 PM

Mister Spak

"I would be entirely unsurprised if owls shared the same species as birds like pidgeons."

OK, lets cross a hummingbird with a California Condor and see the results.

6/25/2008 4:17:50 PM


I want to ride in a cart pulled by a giraffe-zebra hybrid. There's a parade next week and it would be so cool...

6/25/2008 4:21:07 PM


FERTILE offspring.

6/25/2008 4:29:46 PM

David B.

xander8 wrote: "I want to ride in a cart pulled by a giraffe-zebra hybrid. There's a parade next week and it would be so cool..."

I think I saw that parade. Was it on Mulberry Street?

6/25/2008 5:10:38 PM


You know what, dicking around with redefined science terms pisses me off more than making up words altogether. Go back to your 'kind' bullshit so I know what the fuck you're talking about.

6/25/2008 5:23:12 PM


Who said humans and monkeys, or even apes are of the same species?

6/25/2008 5:49:43 PM


And I had to devote 4 years of my young adulthood getting a biology degree.

Should have spent more time with beer and frat parties.

6/25/2008 5:57:19 PM


Healthy viable offspring. Horses and Donkeys are not the same thing... See Jesus on stallion pictures... Its freaking awesome, his horse is like white and rearing up and there is lightning. It looks like an iron maiden cover. A donkey would be less impressive.

Giraffes do not produce viable offspring with zebras... OR HORSES.

6/25/2008 6:15:05 PM

sofia the antichrist

Maybe true_blue is into bestiality, and this is his way of rationalizing it.

6/25/2008 7:09:46 PM


Giraffes are actually more similar to cows. I mean, among all the other reasons you failed.

6/25/2008 7:18:04 PM


Giraffes do NOT produce fertile offspring with horses or zebras!

Yes, I know other people in this thread have said this.
But it bears repeating.

6/25/2008 7:32:49 PM

Old Viking

I once crossed a tiger with a parrot. The result was exceedingly strange, but when it spoke, you listened!

6/25/2008 7:44:35 PM

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