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Quote# 46108

[This is comment #13 under an open letter to Rick Warren.]


I think it is interesting that you guys are trying to put the ball in believers courts all the time.

You have NO proof whatsoever that there is NO God, but you skip all your arguments and say it is up to only us.

Now you are saying that if our beliefs do not measure up to your ideas of "reasonable" then they should be disregarded. This is close to communism. If you could not make decisions based upon faith, then there would be nothing left for believers to do in public government.

Way to go guys, it is obvious that you are trying to silence us. It is not going to work.

Rick Pucket, Life Without Faith 41 Comments [8/28/2008 8:49:06 PM]
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Submitted By: David D.G.
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J. Random Lurker

I think it is interesting that you guys are trying to put the ball in non-believers courts all the time.

You have NO proof whatsoever that there is a God, but you skip all your arguments and say it is up to only us.

Now you are saying that if our beliefs do not measure up to your ideas of "reasonable" then they should be disregarded. This is close to totalitarianism. If you could not make decisions based upon reason, then there would be nothing left for non-believers to do in public government.

Way to go guys, it is obvious that you are trying to silence us. It is not going to work.

Fixed.

8/28/2008 8:56:02 PM

dpareja

I'm only going to say this once: the proposition that there is no God is unprovable, while the proposition that there is a God is provable, so one assumes the unprovable proposition until there is sufficient evidence to discard it and declare its negation (the provable proposition) proved.

Hence we assume there's no God, but if there were enough evidence, we'd be willing to accept the existence of a God.

8/28/2008 8:56:50 PM

Rat of Steel

"I think it is interesting that you guys are trying to put the ball in believers' courts all the time."

That makes one of us, as that's where this proverbial ball belongs.

"You have NO proof whatsoever that there is NO God, but you skip all your arguments and say it is up to only us."

Mehh. *shrugs* Not my fault that that's how burden of proof works. Perhaps you'd think differently if you went into a courtroom as the defendant and the judicial standard had been rewritten to read "guilty until proven innocent"?

Bah, who'm I kidding? The vast majority of fundies think that way every time they argue with someone they don't like.

"Now you are saying that if our beliefs do not measure up to your ideas of 'reasonable' then they should be disregarded. This is close to communism."

Ummm, no, it's not. Not even remotely close. Communism is the political belief that there is, and ought to be, no such thing as private property; that all material wealth officially belongs to the State, to reapportion to its citizens as needed.

"If you could not make decisions based upon faith, then there would be nothing left for believers to do in public government."

And this is a bad thing, because....??

Face it, chump. Public officials swear upon a Bible to uphold and defend the Constitution, NOT vice versa. If you want to live in a country where "persons of faith" are allowed (and even encouraged) to play an active role in government, the Middle East has several options available to you even now. Go ahead; I'll help you pack your things if need be.

"Way to go guys, it is obvious that you are trying to silence us. It is not going to work."

Cue pie chart in five, four, three, two, one....

8/28/2008 9:00:07 PM

RavenWood

Look, put up, or shut up. Quit your fucking whining.

8/28/2008 9:01:31 PM

TheOutsider

Logic: You're doing it wrong!

8/28/2008 9:02:28 PM

Gawd

Someone needs a class in logic and a dictionary to look up the word "communism".

The burden of proof is on he who asserts the positive, as it is impossible to prove an unrestricted negative. I could make hundreds of assertions that no one could ever DISprove, so you see why it doesn't work like that.

Communism is an economic system that is wholly unrelated to atheism, any sort of religious dogma or philosophy. Dipshit.

8/28/2008 9:03:22 PM

Lucilius

"If you could not make decisions based upon faith, then there would be nothing left for believers to do in public government."

Exactly. What I've been sayin' for years. Now get the fuck out of office.

8/28/2008 9:06:10 PM

Horsefeathers

"You have NO proof whatsoever that there is NO God, but you skip all your arguments and say it is up to only us."

The onus is on you my woefully ill prepared friend. That's how it works; you claim something exists/is true/happens/etc and you get to provide evidence for it. I don't have to do a damned thing until you substantiate your claims.

"Now you are saying that if our beliefs do not measure up to your ideas of "reasonable" then they should be disregarded."

I'm guessing the term "reasonable" was used in a general sense that, if religion weren't involved, you'd agree to also. In other words, your beliefs have to stand up to general scrutiny. Which they don't.

"This is close to communism."

Huh?

"If you could not make decisions based upon faith, then there would be nothing left for believers to do in public government."

And this is bad, why again?

"Way to go guys, it is obvious that you are trying to silence us. It is not going to work."

Obviously. You whiny fucks never shut up, even when you get your way.

8/28/2008 9:10:07 PM

MK

This was to Rick Warren?

Man, it's always fascinating when they start eating their own.

8/28/2008 9:15:10 PM

Darn

@Rat of Steel
Ummm, no, it's not. Not even remotely close. Communism is the political belief that there is, and ought to be, no such thing as private property; that all material wealth officially belongs to the State, to reapportion to its citizens as needed.

Ummm, no, it's not, communism is the political belief that there should be no such thing as property, period.
Produce/Contribute according to your ability and consume according to your needs.


8/28/2008 9:29:02 PM

anonymous_troy

By saying, "God is an unnecessary entity whose existence must be proven in order to be accepted" we're trying to silence you?

That's like the opposite of the truth.

8/28/2008 9:32:51 PM

Nightboomfer

Something about proving a negative, burden of proof is on those who make the claim, etc.

8/28/2008 9:34:32 PM

Rat of Steel

(@ Darn)

I stand corrected.

*shrugs* Mehhh, at least: a) my incorrect statement was based on what I thought I remembered from a textbook which didn't need to be used to prove its own truth, and b) I realize when I'm mistaken, and admit to it when necessary. Show me one fundie who can do either of those things with a straight face, and I'll have not just an egg, but an entire omelette to clean off my face.

8/28/2008 9:44:42 PM

Grigadil

I believe that you believe there is a god. I see no point in believing in the god you believe in, because I believe (from his own reputed words) that he's a shithead and a waste of my faith.

I have faith that the Grand Unified Theory will accurately account for every physical process in the universe, eventually.

8/28/2008 10:05:40 PM

Jay-Sus

I think you just raped and murdered logic and dumped it's body in the woods.

8/28/2008 10:08:16 PM

Laura

Waaahh, fuck you. YOU'RE the ones who want us to live by the stupid book that your god supposedly wrote, so YOU are required to prove that there is a god and that he is the one who wrote this book. If you can't do that, then stop whining because society doesn't want to live under your oppressive "moral" code.

8/28/2008 10:18:08 PM

Mrs. Antichrist

Burden of proof, motherfucker.

8/28/2008 10:49:54 PM

Headache

Rick Pucket, using multi-syllable words does not make you look smart. The content shows you for the moron you really are!

8/28/2008 10:53:07 PM

Giveitaday

You have NO proof whatsoever that there is NO God, but you skip all your arguments and say it is up to only us.

And you have no proof that there is, so the logical default position would be to disbelive. Just because there are gardens should one also belive that there are faeries?

Now you are saying that if our beliefs do not measure up to your ideas of "reasonable" then they should be disregarded. This is close to communism

No really it's not, in fact it has nothing to do with communism. I'd suggest consaulting a dictionary before making statements that make you appear ignorant and uneducated, it does nothing to help your argument.

If you could not make decisions based upon faith, then there would be nothing left for believers to do in public government.

You could make decisions based on the will of the people that you intend to govern. Like a democracy is supposed to do.

Way to go guys, it is obvious that you are trying to silence us. It is not going to work.

I personally, and no atheist I know has any intent to silence you or any other christian. I value your free speech as much as I do my own. To silence you would open the door for others to silence me. I do, however, draw the line at you and your religion trying to pass legislation imposing your religious beliefs on myself and other non-christians.

8/28/2008 11:09:47 PM

Porky Pine

Everytime you open your mouth, a invisible leprechaun sticks his dick in.

Prove me wrong mf.

8/28/2008 11:57:37 PM

Patches

If we have to prove that your god doesn't exist to justify not believing in it, then you have to prove all the other gods don't exist to justify only believing in yours.

And then come up with a reason why your justification of dismissing all the other gods can't be used on yours (and "because mine has a book about him" doesn't count).

8/29/2008 12:15:18 AM

John

You have NO proof whatsoever that there is NO God

So what? Why would that prevent someone from proving there is a God? "I don't have to answer X because you can't answer Y" is a pretty stupid argument.

8/29/2008 12:24:08 AM

Allegory for Jesus

"You have NO proof whatsoever that there is NO God, but you skip all your arguments and say it is up to only us."

Russell's teapot. Burden of proof. And, the thing, we don't have to prove that there is no God, because we DON'T CARE! The existence of invisible, unverifiable entities with traits X, Y, Z is the not the subject that we are concerned about. The problem is the number of people asserting that the above unverifiable entity is 1. real 2. the source of morality and 3. a justification for strong-arming everyone who is not of a similar opinion into agreeing with you that we take issue with.

"Now you are saying that if our beliefs do not measure up to your ideas of "reasonable" then they should be disregarded."

Ideally yes. But we don't give a damn about your personal beliefs...it's the actions that stem from those beliefs that worry us.

"If you could not make decisions based upon faith, then there would be nothing left for believers to do in public government."

Except...you know...work and make decisions based on logic and reason.

"Way to go guys, it is obvious that you are trying to silence us. It is not going to work."

And the persecution complex makes its appearance. Bravo. Yes, our intention is to silence you. To get you to shut up about your religion when in state institutions, to stop shoving it on other people, stop using it as an excuse to condemn other people, and stop pretending that it grants you immunity to criticism. But, one can only dream.

8/29/2008 1:34:02 AM

Sasha

If you could not make decisions based upon faith, then there would be nothing left for believers to do in public government

What an excellent argument for keeping fundies out of government.

8/29/2008 2:00:32 AM

doomie 22

"Way to go guys, it is obvious that you are trying to silence us. It is not going to work."

If asking you for proof of God leaves you silent then what does that say about the existence of your god?

8/29/2008 2:15:09 AM
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