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Quote# 54521

[Another poster]
We "change" the world when we are living in the Spirit among the people, not when we force it to be what we want/think it should be.

[Chelsea responds]

There are a few posts here that allude to the same thing. I take exception to this argument, based on the following:

*Some people don't learn by example. Some people could care less about example. I wouldn't discourage anyone from doing so, but we live in a fallen world.

*How can anyone here talk about Christians "forcing" (a favorite buzzword) their views down the throats of others? Isn't this what the homosexual lobby is doing? We are merely defending our nation by opposing them, which is our right.

*If we only live by example, we are essentially keeping the Gospel to ourselves, and not sharing it with the world. And this, of course, is contrary to the Great Commission.

I will not retreat solely into example, but turn outwards and defend the Lord whenever I get the chance.

Chelsea Moore, Boundless.org's "The Line" blog comment 29 Comments [12/21/2008 7:14:16 PM]
Fundie Index: 3
Submitted By: GreenEyedLilo
WTF?! || meh
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t3h_fuhr3r

It's amazing that they honestly believe that making others to adhere to their archaic moral codes is anything BUT forcing their beliefs on anyone.
Somehow, I don't think Jesus would approve.

12/21/2008 7:20:03 PM

aaa

Yawn...

12/21/2008 7:30:31 PM

pete

Please explain how an ignorant fundy, such as yourself, is going to "defend the Lord". Isn't He supposed to be all-knowing and all-powerful?

12/21/2008 7:55:38 PM

a mind far far away

There's nothing wrong with having beliefs. There's nothing wrong with stating why you think they're right. It's wrong to try and force other people to believe what you believe when they obviously have no intention of doing so. And that is the fundies favorite pasttime. Forcing others to believe as they do, and crying persecution when they are not allowed to do so. I forget which church father it was, but one of them said "wherever you go, preach the gospel, and if necessary, use words." Some people don't learn by example, but at least people will see that you're not a complete fucking hypocrite.

12/21/2008 8:03:46 PM

Devonian

Just once can a fundie mention homosexuality without using the phrase "force it down our throats"? At least this one appears to be female, which makes it slightly less ironic than usual...

12/21/2008 8:04:28 PM

Grigadil

O Yea, defend thou thy Lord as He is impotent and too stupid to survive on His own.

12/21/2008 8:25:34 PM

Giveitaday

*How can anyone here talk about Christians "forcing" (a favorite buzzword) their views down the throats of others? Isn't this what the homosexual lobby is doing? We are merely defending our nation by opposing them, which is our right

A few points that seems to be beneath your notice.

1. Demanding that someone adhere to your religious moral code or else is "forcing" your beliefs upon them.

2. The "homosexual lobby" isn't "forcing" anything on you. They are not asking you to be gay, to try homosexuality, or anything of the kind. They want to have the same rights as everone else, to be able to love who they love, to marry whom they wish, and to not be treated as some kind second class citizen just because their view on sexuality doesn't line up with what your religion says. None of those amount to "forcing" their views on you, it's just asking the same respect for their sexuality as you demand for your religion.

3. First, it's not your nation, it's theirs too. Christians don't have a monopoly on US citizenship. The gay community has never declared "war" on this country or your religion, nor are you defending this country. You do a great disservice to the ideals of the US by trying to exclude people from the freedom that this country was founded upon. Freedom that you would claim for yourself but deny to others is not freedom at all. You are defending your own bigotry and nothing else.

12/21/2008 8:27:00 PM

Old Viking

Homosexuals merely want the same civil rights you enjoy, and to be left the hell alone. You feel you have a Great Commission to annoy the shit out of everyone, then get all quivery-lipped when you're told to piss off.

12/21/2008 8:37:24 PM

John

If we only live by example, we are essentially keeping the Gospel to ourselves, and not sharing it with the world.

Good. Hold that thought. Why should the rest of us give a fuck about your "Great Commission"? Just because your religion tells you to pester people with your beliefs doesn't mean you're not annoying. If my religion had a Great Commission to crap on your lawn, does that mean you'd welcome my doing it?


12/21/2008 8:39:57 PM

solomongrundy

a mind far far away wrote:
There's nothing wrong with having beliefs.

There is when they're completely illogical and fly in the face of all the evidence. The belief the Earth is the centre of the universe is wrong, the belief the Sun orbits the Earth is wrong and the belief that the book of Bronze Age mythology that teaches that both those things are true is infallible is wrong too.

12/21/2008 8:44:42 PM

WMDKitty

The OP referenced is quite sane. The rest of this is just fucked up. Didn't St. Francis of Assisi say "Preach the Gospel; use words if you must"? Seriously, people wouldn't be so freakin' hostile towards Christians if they'd just shut up and lead by EXAMPLE.

Too bad *they* can't/won't understand that.

12/21/2008 9:00:51 PM

rw23

Is it just me or can this be read as an exhortation to propaganda by deed rather than simply propaganda by word?

12/21/2008 9:02:24 PM

Pule Thamex

Hello my dear. No thank you, I don't wish you to share the Gospels with me. I've got my own (they're in the bible on my bookshelf).

The reasons why are straight-forward and should be easy to understand.

There is no such thing as god.

Belief is a stupid thing.

I am not a lover of willful stupidity and gullibility.

I dislike hatred, bigotry, hypocrisy and lies.

I am not right-wing.

I dislike evangHELLists.

I dislike deceptive and deceitful pastors.

There are are more but I'm busy a minute.


12/21/2008 10:25:17 PM

Papabear

"*How can anyone here talk about Christians "forcing" (a favorite buzzword) their views down the throats of others? Isn't this what the homosexual lobby is doing? We are merely defending our nation by opposing them, which is our right."

A basic difference between the homosexuals and the Christian Fundies is that gays want the right to live as they wish, whereas the Fundies want the right to have all of us live like them.



P.S. The passage containing the "Great Commission" is a forgery, a later addition to the NT.

12/21/2008 11:09:11 PM

Rat of Steel

"How can anyone here talk about Christians 'forcing' (a favorite buzzword) their views down the throats of others?"

It's more than a mere buzzword, Chelsea. Christians have been passing laws for centuries dictating how non-Christians must live, and sometimes taking very brutal measures to enforce the spirit of those laws. You have been free to be who you are within the minimal boundaries of basic interpersonal harmony that is human society. All "the homosexual lobby" wants is to be free to do the same, by marrying someone whom they love, as opposed to marrying someone they don't love simply for the sake of public image.

"Isn't this what the homosexual lobby is doing?"

No one is forcing you to marry a woman, Chelsea. No one is forcing you to like (or even pretend to like) the idea of men marrying men, or women marrying women. All "the homosexual lobby" wants is the same right to life, liberty, and pursuing happiness that straight people enjoy.

"We are merely defending our nation by opposing them, which is our right."

I get the distinct impression that, by, "our nation", you mean "our Christian nation". To that I can only reply...


"I will not retreat solely into example, but turn outwards and defend the Lord whenever I get the chance."

Turning one's effort outwards during a struggle is called attacking, Chelsea. The noise you've been hearing in recent years from "the homosexual lobby" is simply the targets of your attack no longer being willing to put up with it.

12/21/2008 11:32:23 PM

storymoron

Yet another great gem from that blog, GreenEyedLilo. I sometimes post on their comment board, though most of the time I just get really frustrated and start swearing at my monitor.

12/22/2008 12:46:41 AM

CT

And this, of course, is contrary to the Great Commission.

As Papabear pointed out, that stuff was a forgery added later.

If we only live by example, we are essentially keeping the Gospel to ourselves, and not sharing it with the world.

However, Jesus said that to teach the Gospel by how you live, NOT by shoving into people's faces all the time. Was Jesus wrong?

I will not retreat solely into example, but turn outwards and defend the Lord whenever I get the chance.

Yes, defend him by going against his instructions... did you miss the problem with that?

12/22/2008 12:47:00 AM

FMG

1. We actually live in a much more peaceful world. Your OWN BIBLE points out that Slavery and Rape were common place. Your God claims to be a God of the Slaves. We have come a long way since then (Your story is actually false)

2. Gay people want equal rights. They want to marry whoever they chose. You are not allowing them their rights for archaic reasons that make no sense.

3. Muslims are also supposed to do what you do. But you have a problem when they do it. Or when anyone else does it.

12/22/2008 12:48:27 AM

Shadoboy

CONVERT OR GO TO HELL FOR ALL ETERNITY BECAUSE THE BIBLE SAYS SO!!!!!!

How is that not forcing beleifs in people?

12/22/2008 4:20:49 AM

Antichrist

Because it's much easier to preach the bullshit to others than to try and live it yourself.


12/22/2008 5:30:59 AM

QT

So you not only acknowledge that you are to force your religion on others, but acknowledge that "spreading the word" is an official part of your religion, but you still refuse to recognize when you are actually forcing your views on others?

WUT

12/22/2008 7:06:46 AM

Lilith

It's about time that FSM followers started banging in fundy Christians' doors at ungody hours and let them see how annoying it is.

12/22/2008 9:58:48 AM

freako104

I have yet to have gays tell me I am wrong for being straight. Christians on the other hand...

12/22/2008 3:00:47 PM

Rubyfruit

The hypocrisy, it does fucking burn. It's almost like if anyone who isn't lock-step with the Fundies, if they make one little peep, at all, they're "forcing their views down people's throats" while those who are Fundies do pester and scream and shout and try to make laws based on their beliefs into the law of the land are free from such accusations.

The hypocrisy does burn.

12/22/2008 11:40:13 PM

Quantum Mechanic

One would think an omnipotent, omniscient deity wouldn't need an idiot like Chelsea Moore to defend shit.

1/18/2011 7:42:18 PM
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