I can't help but be very skeptical about science that is based on conjecture and speculation. I just finished a semester of college biology and the closed-minded adherence to Darwinism and uniformitarianism is sickening. They present pseudo-arguments from the other side, but the arguments are presented in such a way as to present Darwins dissenters as Creationists or religious zealots. Evolutionists aren't just biologists...they are paleontologists and geologists as well. They all operate on the pre-concieved idea that evolution happened and that the earth is billions of years old. That is just an assumed 'fact'. They all work together to come up with dates for rocks or fossils...geologists with consult with evolutionists about the age of a certain rock layer based on the fossils found there and evolutionists will date fossils based on the estimated age of the rock. Most of it is based on conjecture rather than real, hard facts. They all have a vested interest in proving their theories...the Darwinists need lots and lots of time for evolution to happen by Darwinist means, and uniformitarian geologists also need a very old planet to prove their theory. In a way, it's hard to blame them. There simply is no other possible way for life on earth to happen by a purely materialistic means, so if they can't prove it true then they are going to find themselves up the proverbial creek without a clue. That is not to say that all science is dishonest or untrustworthy....just that 'evidence' needs to be taken with a grain of salt.
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Most of it is based on conjecture rather than real, hard facts.
Well, kikos, if you have hard facts (outside of any holy books) that point to a young earth and that stand up to scientific scrunity, then publish them.
"There simply is no other possible way for life on earth to happen by a purely materialistic means," "so if they can't prove it true then they are going to find themselves up the proverbial creek without a clue." "That is not to say that all science is dishonest or untrustworthy....just that 'evidence' needs to be taken with a grain of salt.
The ToE does have some holes in it, too. Such as the mass-extinction periods. Life seems to rebound awfully fast from them......and both sides in the debate are fond of setting up straw-men who look like their opponents.
This does not mean that Creationism, or ID, are correct. To my mind, the ToE, despite its unanswered questions, is still the best theory we have. However, nothing is sacred - including the ToE. How are we to improve our understanding of it if we refuse to question it?
How are we to improve our understanding of it if we refuse to question it?
Are people really doing that? Keep in mind that saying evolution is the best theory we have at the moment is not the same thing as saying it's the only theory.
Also, just because people make fun of creationism doesn't mean they don't question the details of evolution.
@ Mat: Why's that a problem for the ToE? Usually, the ecological niches a population might evolve to fill are already filled, so most potential evolution remains just that. After a mass extinction event there's a lot of room to fill, literally and metaphorically. Potentials are more likely to become actuals.
"I just finished a semester of college biology"
WOW!!! He's actually taken 4 WHOLE CREDIT HOURS of biology, (freshman level, intro, no doubt) so obviously this makes his education far superior to men and women who have studied the subject in depth for decades, and supplemented their coursework with actual lab work, field studies, and experiments.
I wonder, what this wingnut would say if I took a SINGLE course in religious studies, from a well-renowned Christian college, and complained that the "Closed minded adherence to Christianity and Paulianity is sickening" After all, they "Operate on the pre-concieved idea that Creation happened, and the Bible is infallible in every respect" "Most of it is conjecture rather than real, hard facts"
Well, obviously those geologists should stop asking biologists how to date rock layers and refer to the Bible.
There are no such sciences as Evolutionism and Darwinism. Studying those things is part of Biology, which I think you should know since you were in a biology course.
"They all operate on the pre-concieved idea that evolution happened and that the earth is billions of years old. That is just an assumed 'fact'."
No, these are fairly well-established facts. No reason to start questioning it everytime a Creationist student comes along.
Mat:
Not a single person will object to you questioning the Theory of Evolution, quite the opposite, it will be welcomed, if and only if your new theory can explain the current evidence better and more coherent and have better accuracy in predicting what should be found of fossils and why.
Questioning ToE with religion is useless and totally missing the mark. You need to propose a new scientific theory that can replace ToE, you are more than welcome to do so. In fact, if you do, you will go down in history and will have a life long stardom that even might surpass Einstein's. Not to mention a quick trip to Stockholm to pick up a Nobel prize.
And this is exactly what every scientist dream about doing! It's a scientists wet dream and heaven combined.
So, if you have something good, spill the beans!
@Blaidd Drwg (Bad Wolf)
You give him too much credit. The freshman intro, non-science major biology at the local university here is only 3 credits. If he's going to a local community college you can bet there was no lab attached either. (As is required for the University.)
Now, to Kikos... OWN A DAMN REPTILE. I still say you'll figure out real fast there is more than this creation stuff happening.
Oh for fuck's sake, I'm going to type this next part real slowly and very loudly just so you can fucking understand it. THERE IS NO FUCKING MASSIVE CONSPIRACY AMONGST SCIENTISTS TO DOGMATICALLY ADHERE TO DARWIN'S THEORY OF EVOLUTION, YOU MORON. In fact, we've actually *learned* some fucking things since his theory was first published, you retard. I'm not even that educated about the ToE, and even I know this shit, you dumb fuck. Also, regarding your stupid little point about geologists, there actually is (and I know your puny little brain won't be able to comprehend this) hard evidence supporting the conclusion that the earth is billions of years old, you fucking drooling dunce.
In conclusion: Go fuck yourself with a broken broom while giving a diseased transvestite a blowjob, you sniveling simpleton.
As a college biology teacher, this is the kind of student who makes me want to bang my head repeatedly against the wall. This is the student who doesn't listen, never takes notes, rarely comes to class and then wonders why he's failing. This is the student who fails all of the tests and turns in no homework, yet expects to get an A at the end of the course. There is nothing in this paragraph to show he learned ANYTHING. Not even a few words.
Cor! That's interesting. So, do you have an alternative theory? Please do tell. It's bound to be something completely revolutionary and extraordinary. Can't wait to hear it. Although, excuse me if I don't hold my breath.
ARFAB
I just finished a semester of college biology [Giant worldwide conspiracy theory with no motive whatsoever except scientists apparently being huge assholes] the 'evidence' needs to be taken with a grain of salt.
Typical bullshit from someone who probably failed highschool biology. When will people learn that claiming credentials they prove unworthy of in the same paragraph and rambling about a giant, invisible and utterly pointless conspiracy doesnt invalidate the evidence people keep throwing at them?
@Painful:
@iBelieve:
And, the things we "assume" to be true are not just things we made up. It's not like scientists sat down and said "We don't want to believe in God, or that God made the earth and everything on it. What could have happened instead? Hmm. . . maybe life evolved from some chemicals in the water. What would we need to believe if we want to hold to this theory? Oh yes, we'd definitely need a very old earth. How old though? Oh, 4.5 billion years should do. [etc.] Alright, it's settled then. Now we just need to share our 'facts' with other people who don't want to believe in the Bible, and we'll be all set!" Science doesn't WORK THAT WAY! Which you would know if you did any real work in science and not just scripted biology labs about the metabolism of mice.
@Wurdulac
In conclusion: Go fuck yourself with a broken broom while giving a diseased transvestite a blowjob , you sniveling simpleton.
You do know that making a mockery of a minority group just panders to these lunatics?
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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