Site/Off-Topic Discussion Thread 4
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[This is not one of those fake church signs: it's the real thing, taken in Arkansas.]
Beryl Baptist Church,
[3/29/2009 2:40:27 PM]
Fundie Index: 248
Submitted By: Tom S. Fox
I've made enough spoof church signs in my time with The Watchtower Apocalyptic Testament (TWAT) to recognize a fake when I see one.
That doesn't make it any less true though.
3/29/2009 11:28:20 PM
The pastor must have reasoned thusly to himself, 'How can I effectively show opposition to reasoning, except, ahem, when I'm doing it, of course. I know, I'll put up a sign opposing reason'. He reasoned to himself that it would be reasonable to assume that the typical fundie dimwit would only laud him for his efforts, being incapable of reasoning for themselves. So, following his own reasoning, he arranged for an anti-reason sign to be erected. Sounds reasonable. Not.
3/29/2009 11:37:10 PM
There's at least 3 churches in the valley I live in that has those BIG reader boards.
3/30/2009 12:01:05 AM
The Amazing Liarbird
Oh, it could be real all right. I know the opinions page of our local newspaper is frequently inundated with fundie letters equal to- and sometimes worse than- this in stupidity and ignorance-worshiping.
People genuinely believing such horrible things is more than a possibility.
3/30/2009 12:53:25 AM
And this is a bad thing how?
3/30/2009 1:01:39 AM
3/30/2009 1:10:51 AM
Yes it is. Which is precisely why reason is so good.
3/30/2009 1:26:53 AM
We use reason and logic in simple everyday decisions.
So when it's cold and wet outside do you wrap up warm? or do you rely on faith to get you through the day?
What about when you drive a car? Do you drive on pure blind faith relying on god to control you? Or do you follow your highway code?
I have to say, if I was their god I'd be insulted by these dimwits.
(P.s. Hooray the edit button is back!)
3/30/2009 1:47:53 AM
Martin Luther is a poe now? All too real, I'm afraid.
3/30/2009 2:43:05 AM
3/30/2009 4:11:39 AM
Definitely an award contender.
3/30/2009 5:13:57 AM
Well. Then they put this sign up for no reason.
3/30/2009 6:41:16 AM
I grew up in Arkansas and have no difficulty in believing this is legit.
Which makes me sigh.
3/30/2009 7:04:15 AM
This appears to not work on my network atm.
Someone want to tell me what it says?
3/30/2009 8:14:27 AM
Please construct a meaningful argument as to why reason is a bad thing, without using reason.
3/30/2009 8:29:34 AM
If reason is enemy number one, I'm guessing reality is number two.
3/30/2009 9:47:58 AM
"The anabaptists pretend that children, not as yet having reason, ought not to receive baptism. I answer: That reason in no way contributes to faith. Nay, in that children are destitute of reason, they are all the more fit and proper recipients of baptism. For reason is the greatest enemy that faith has: it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the Divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God. If God can communicate the Holy Ghost to grown persons, he can, a fortiori, communicate it to young children. Faith comes of the Word of God, when this is heard; little children hear that Word when they receive baptism, and therewith they receive also faith." (Martin Luther, Colloquia Mensa, paragraph CCCLIII)
3/30/2009 11:49:57 AM
"Obviously, this has something to do with baptism, so what is baptism to Luther? Baptism is the moment at which a person receives faith from God (Gonzales, p. 64). This is the cornerstone of the dispute between Luther and the anabaptists: The anabaptists insisted that one must have faith in order to be baptized, while Luther insisted that one needed to have baptism in order to have faith! [It should be noted that baptism, for Luther, did not necessarily have to be by water, but could also simply be performed through the Holy Spirit.] Luther viewed the anabaptist position - fairly or not - as being one in which we must rely on our fallen reason to give us faith so that we can be baptized, making it the work of fallen human beings. True baptism, Luther would argue, is an act of God that gives us faith. The crucial distinction is between fallen reason which cannot understand God - and, yes, even argues against the God revealed on the cross and seeks God instead in the theology of glory - and reason undergirded by faith. That children have not yet developed fallen reason is, for Luther, no reason to refuse them the baptism that can redeem them and their reason."
3/30/2009 11:50:36 AM
What??? I was baptized. Where's the faith?
3/30/2009 1:34:50 PM
This particular one may or may not be fake, but even the relatively non-fundie church my family goes to has published stuff almost just like it.
Yeah, I'm scared.
3/30/2009 1:40:27 PM
Yup, that's why church membership is in decline...because blind faith & reason don't mix!
3/30/2009 3:04:53 PM
Couldn't have said it better myself!
3/30/2009 5:19:08 PM
I laud the honesty so that people may see what religion truly is.
3/30/2009 5:58:57 PM
The Amazing Liarbird
@ #931537 Raskolnikof
Ahah! That must be why my baptism didn't "take" and I never received faith -- my pubes grew early.
3/30/2009 6:37:34 PM
At least the church gives us a warning!
3/30/2009 8:06:17 PM