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I will agree that it's symbolic of the resurrection story, but a symbol doesn't prove jack.
10/25/2009 5:06:07 AM
about waste deep
In other words, you're full of shit.
10/25/2009 5:14:05 AM
'waste deep' indeed.
do you really think that using water to cleanse only came about in the last two millennia? you poor dumb beast.
10/25/2009 5:14:55 AM
Really reaching there, aren't ya, Bill?
10/25/2009 5:16:35 AM
Um water and resurrection are a big theme in pretty much all MYTHOLOGIES.
10/25/2009 5:17:06 AM
Your standard of evidence is rather shallow, it's only "waste" deep.
10/25/2009 5:19:00 AM
My eye itched earlier today.
10/25/2009 5:20:36 AM
Erhm...sorry but the immersion in water predates Christianity...Jesus himself was said to have been Baptized...so no...nothing to do with the resurrection...
10/25/2009 5:23:57 AM
Besides, doesn't the bible mention John immersing people in water before Jesus comes along? What was he proving?
10/25/2009 5:27:04 AM
So...what was symbolized when my older brother used to hold my head under water at the pool?
10/25/2009 5:37:04 AM
The cause - The event is testimony to a historical happening some 2000 years ago - the physical resurrection of Jesus. What other historical explanation do we have for the 2000 year old presence of baptism by immersion in the church?
Would this be the same tradition of baptism by immersion that predates not only christianity, but the supposed Christ himself?
Indeed, evidence of Jesus's resurrection was witnessed today.
No, it wasn't. It was evidence that some woman was immersed in water as a form of religious ritual and nothing else. It's like saying that someone going to sleep and later waking up and arising from bed is the equivalent of being an eyewitness to the ressurection. Even if the woman died and arose from the dead 3 days later it still would not be evidence that Jesus did, only evidence that the she did.
10/25/2009 5:44:07 AM
"Evidence of Jesus' resurrection from the dead was witnessed yesterday."
Bullshit! Typical religionist, don't have any evidence to back up your irrational beliefs? No matter, just lie!
"What other historical explanation do we have for the 2000 year old presence of baptism by immersion in the church?"
Mental illness, brain damage, stupidity and ignorance.
10/25/2009 5:44:42 AM
So being dunked in water in front of a group of people is proof someone came back from the dead? How's that again?
10/25/2009 5:46:56 AM
So your support of a thought is a ritual that one performs? then every religion in the world must be as real as yours because they all have rituals they have aswell.
I'll ask again, where in the bible does it say followers have to be dumb as shit on a rock?
10/25/2009 5:53:20 AM
Not especially fundie ... his interpretation of Romans "We were buried with Christ by baptism into death ..." may be a bit overly literal, but it just sounds like a normal Christian church initiation.
10/25/2009 6:03:04 AM
I hope that when I'm old and grey my senility is not as debilitating as Bill's obvious mental deterioration is. It's not that I'd mind people laughing at my crumbling mind as much as that I would hate to be the silly old codger who's lost his marbles and talks like a dribbling moron and who has to rely on others for practically everything.
10/25/2009 6:14:28 AM
I'll have to remember your standard for evidence when I'm on jury duty next month.
10/25/2009 6:22:06 AM
Your threshold for proof is nothing short of pathetic.
10/25/2009 6:23:18 AM
Your claims are flimsy.
10/25/2009 6:26:34 AM
"from a simple historical cause - effect relationship there is only one way to explain what was witnessed"
My cat believes that things that change position while she's out of the room moved on their own. That must be proof they're alive.
IN any case you'd best learn the difference between a symbol and a proof.
10/25/2009 6:38:14 AM
@ John - Yes, the mere symbolic interpretation on its own isn't fundie...
But he's claiming it's proof of Jesus' resurrection.
I think you got caught up in reading his account of the typical baptism and sort of forgot about the first line: Evidence of Jesus' resurrection from the dead was witnessed yesterday. Yes, 'evidence'. Bill here thinks Baptism is proof that Jesus rose from the dead.
If that isn't fundie, I don't know what is*.
*Okay, I do, but that way was more dramatic.
10/25/2009 6:44:12 AM
Jezebel's Evil Sister
"... a pool of water about waste deep. ..."
She was baptized in a giant, unflushed toilet? Ewwwww!
10/25/2009 6:50:04 AM
This summer, I went to the beach and saw about 150 people go into the water and then come out. Didn't mean one damn spritual thing then and it didn't mean anything during your priest's wet t-shirt contest.
10/25/2009 6:51:02 AM
If I remember correctly according to the bible Jesus corpse didn´t lie in water before it was allegedly resurrected
In fact if you want to see the ritual as historic evidence for something, it is rather an evidence for the baptism ritual used by John the Baptist (which btw. is older than the resurrection of Jesus ) ;)
10/25/2009 6:54:31 AM
"Evidence of Jesus' resurrection from the dead was witnessed yesterday. Granted it happened in a church."
Drat. No wonder I missed it.
"Yet from a simple historical cause - effect relationship there is only one way to explain what was witnessed."
I very seriously doubt that.
"The effect - A new mother and wife of one of the members decided she wanted to become a Christian, to confess in front of the bunch (about 50 folk) that Jesus was her Lord and Savior.
Having done that, the walls were slid left and right and the preacher, her husband and she walked into a pool of water about waste deep.
She then was baptized, laid prone under the water (immersed) and caused to stand up again."
"The picture is clear. She stood (alive as a sinner), laid prone (was buried in the water) and stood up again (born again, raised from the dead)."
You're quite deluded, no?
"The cause - The event is testimony to a historical happening some 2000 years ago - the physical resurrection of Jesus. What other historical explanation do we have for the 2000 year old presence of baptism by immersion in the church?"
You know that baptism with water is a very ancient ritual, right? Does the name John the Baptist ring a bell? Jewish temples in Jerusalem had pools in which to ritually bath prior to entering them. I believe the Egyptians, among other cultures/religions, also used some form of it.
In other words, you don't have a fucking clue what you're talking about. Which, oddly enough, wasn't a total surprise.
"Indeed, evidence of Jesus's resurrection was witnessed today."
Yeah, sure. How about you just ask your imaginary friend to pay me a visit in person. I'd give you my address but, being omniscient and all, I don't think he'd need it.
10/25/2009 6:59:48 AM
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