In the real world, being openly gay in the military can, and will, result in some of these folks getting their throats slit while on night ops by some real crazy military types. If you’re that bent on pushing your lifestyle choice in everybody’s face, the military isn’t the place to do it. But, go ahead and reap the results. You can’t complain when you’re dead.
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Why don't you openly push your opinion in the military? If you're so right, you will never be kicked out, and your death threat won't land you in jail. Well go test your theory and let people know about your fantasies.
Really? So, knowing that I am gay will get my throat slit?
So no helping out your fellow soldier on the battlefield?
You would really rather murder someone?
Oh dear Carl Sagan, can't we get rid of humans such as these? Holding the moral high ground is so difficult when faced with such willful harm.
You say this like they'd be justified in doing so. If someone got his throat slit for proselytizing to his squad, this guy would be baying for blood, but if it's just a fag, he's expendable.
Agreed with David B.: Who is the problem here? Anyone unstable enough to murder a fellow soldier shouldn't be in the military.
To say nothing of the gay or lesbian soldiers' ability to defend themselves; they are soldiers, after all.
I know one recently female former soldier who could kill with her bare hands if she had to.
"In the real world, being openly gay in the military can, and will, result in some of these folks getting their throats slit while on night ops by some real crazy military types."
It's been my experience that the "real crazy military types" aren't actually in the military and, likely, never have been as they can't pass any sort of psychological exam. Besides, they're too busy hiding in their bunker stroking all of their penis substitutes--er, guns--and waiting for the day the government decides to storm their insignificant ass to "take all their guns" and send them to a concentration camp, or some silly shit.
"If you’re that bent on pushing your lifestyle choice in everybody’s face, the military isn’t the place to do it."
Of course not. The military is the place to do what you're told and keep your mouth shut. Something you should try, incidentally.
"But, go ahead and reap the results. You can’t complain when you’re dead."
I'm not sure if this was an attempt at humor or if you're just an idiot.
In your hypothetical future world, that's the way you (sexually?) fantasise it will be. In the real world of today, in the many military forces around the world with openly gay soldiers, this is not a problem.
If you’re that bent on pushing your lifestyle choice in everybody’s face, the military isn’t the place to do it.
Tell that to all the asshats that keep trying to evangelize to the military.
...some of these folks getting their throats slit while on night ops by some real crazy military types.
Wouldn't it be better to remove the real crazy military types as they don;t seems to fit in a sane military. Such people should not be allowed to serve in any form of military unit, rather be locked up in a mental asylum.
My father was in UK military in World War Two. He said that of course there were lots of gay people in the military, otherwise you could avoid conscription by pretending to be gay.
Also we needed people to help the Resistance in France, and most of the people who could speak French were in the fashion trade and gay.
Very very brave people and lots of them lost thier lives
"real crazy military types"
That's a subset filing term on the F.B.I. criminal files. Cheneys Blackwater recruits some of their people from it under the "Bezerker Requisite Program"
Shhhh, Cheney thinks it's a secret, like his love of other peoples suffering
Huh. Because of my paranoid personality disorder I'm not eligible to serve in the military, apparently because I have the potential to go berzerker, but crazy bastards who'd kill people for being gay are ? Something's whack there, and while an army of psychopaths might be extremely alarming to the enemy, I kind of doubt that it would be particularly effective.
Translation: If you're gay, we will kill you.
Great way to treat your brothers-in-arms, that.
If you’re that bent on pushing your lifestyle choice in everybody’s face, the military isn’t the place to do it.
Haha, and all that invading other countries and setting up governments stuff is what, exactly?
Lifestyle choice?
Can you prove it's a choice? If so, let's hear your proof.
If not, I call you out for the liar that you are.
I note your seeming approval of murder. Is this a normal christian trait, or should I be asking you: "Where is Abel, thy brother?" Or are you capable of giving an answer to such a question?
"You can’t complain when you’re dead."
No, but your estate sure as hell can.
(Note to Brits: In America, "estate" refers to all the property, collectively, of a deceased person, and to the executors of said property. It does not carry the implication of a run-down building, like it does in Britain.)
"I'm not prejudiced, I just think they shouldn't do it because they'll be victims of prejudice!!"
Not convincing anybody here, Junkman.
"result in some of these folks getting their throats slit while on night ops by some real crazy military types"
And those "real crazy military types" would then be quite rightfully brought up on murder charges. The system works.
Besides, most of our soldiers really don't care one way or the other about their fellow soldiers' orientation. It's simply not a big deal.
Okay, assuming you're right and this will happen to open gays, the guy who chooses to be in the army is probably qualified to judge whether there are psychos in his unit he should be in fear of his life from, and submit a complaint / conceal shit accordingly.
A rule that takes this decision out of his hands by saying he can be thrown out for allowing it to be discovered, even inadvertently, does not protect him in the least. If our psych reviews are that bad, we can probably afford to leave sane people's coping techniques to their own discretion. It doesn't say anything good about the institutional judgment of the military if it's full of nutjobs instead of professionals.
I don't have any personal primary sources on the matter, but I really, really doubt even that one premise has any foundation, let alone the rest of the argument.
> getting their throats slit while on night ops by some real crazy military types. ... But, go ahead and reap the results. You can’t complain when you’re dead.
Tacit assumption that no one gives shit about "real crazy military types" stabbing the people on their own side.
If shooting your own guys is supposed to improve morale, it sure shouldn't matter who the hell gets shot.
In WW2, Soviet Union used to have a second line of soldiers whose job was to shoot the guys fleeing from the front line. I gather the troops' morale wasn't particularly good.
And the Soviets had conscription. US has a career army. Do you often think of signing up for jobs where you get the choice of being killed by the competitors, your boss, or some random loon who worked with you? Thought so.
The greatest threat to civilization ever known in the whole history and pre-history of the 6000 year old universe is Satan's creation or abomination that he put inside your mother for her sins, namely, your brother the limp-wristed poofta girlie boy, who of course is now out of your mother. Never in the annals of modern or ancient heroic military campaigns has a more virulent threat to the security of mankind been more apparent. Casual conquerer of religious institutions and other like minded deranged organizations of barbaric nincompoops, the gay man has a power unmatched even by Jesus Christ who is powerless in His influence over His gay enemy. The gay man who knocks even God out of His cloud and renders Him powerless in His ability to halt the gay man's march toward world domination. Even Zombie Aliens from space would not pose such an awful threat as the gay man (nobody can pose as fabulously as a gay man, in any case). Radioactive vampire sharks are as nothing to the gay man. He can render them as senseless as a room full of deranged and frothing right-wing morons just by his very gay presence. We might as well surrender now, as nothing can defeat the gay man, not even lies, quote mining, deceit, name-calling, phelpsing, threats, Jesus, God, morons, cretins, retards, Republicans, etc
In the real world, being openly gay might lead to some bullying, but so can being openly fat or scrawny, four-eyed, short or tall, etc, etc.
To exist is a risk-factor of Might Be Bullied.
If you're that bent on pushing your tallness lifestyle choice in everybody's face, serve you right! [/sarcasm]
The one doing the slitting of the throat can still be prosecuted or court-martialled, even when the gay person is dead.
Frankly, I'm way more worried about out-of-control killers slitting the throats of comrades whose sexual orientation they disapprove of than I am about a gay special forces soldier who can follow orders.
Stop using the crazy military types, please.
In the real world, being openly gay in the military can, and will, result in some of these folks getting their throats slit while on night ops by some real crazy military types
And you think that's the gay soldiers fault? Of course you are probably the type of person who bames his wife for making him beat her too.
If you’re that bent on pushing your lifestyle choice in everybody’s face,
I'm sorry, but how exactly is wishing to serve in the miltary without being forced to sneak around in your love life for fear of being discharged, not for anything related to your military performance or rediness, how can that be in anyway construed as "pushing a lifestyle", or anything the fuck else in anyones face? Gays are not demanding the right to have sex in front fellow soldiers they are demanding the right to serve with honor just like any other patriotic american. You're problem is that you think having to acknowledge the fact that gays do exist is somehow "pushing it in your face". It is not.
the military isn’t the place to do it.
Your claims and arguements are not all that different from the bigots who came before you when the military was integrated. They were bullshit then, and they are bullshit now.
Bit late to the party, but...
What David B. and Doubting Thomas said. This is a terrible but all-too-common attitude when applied to homosexuals and other minorities-- that any hate crimes against them or their families are their fault, not a symptom of a way of thinking that says it's okay to hurt people. This is the exacts same argument I saw written in a *letter to the editor* in the local paper about a year ago, arguing against gay adoption. He said that homosexual couples shouldn't be allowed to adopt because their kids would get picked on for it. Because when the victim is the kid of two gays, all of a sudden the bullying isn't the problem anymore.
Anyway...
[/soapbox]
Why do people always assume homophobes are fundies? Like, yeah, this guy's a jackass, but he doesnt mention Gawd or the Babble or anything.
The problem is the "real crazy military types", not the person who's merely open about him/herself.
It's strange that only homophobes have other people's lifestyles pushed in their faces. The rest of us never experience this push.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
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