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Quote# 80852

It seems to me that Homeopathy does work.

Does it really? Maybe the people to ask are the patients and their Doctors, instead of a bunch of frustrated lab nitwits up on their statistics and double blinded, randomized, placebo controlled “studies”. The life threatening illnesses, and their cures, don’t happen in those labs, they happen in the real world, which, oh by the way, is not the domain of the lab b0ffins nor their politicized masters.

Can it possibly work and how? Can a rocket possibly carry men to the moon? How about lasers…are they possible? In the 1930's that would have been dismissed as nonsense.
Who knows until scientists and researchers have had a go at it. Could quantum phenomena be inovlved? Again, who knows until its researched. Neither side can be sure of anything till that’s done. Neither side has the edge on deciding and there’s still those doctors and patients insisting that they benefited from it. What are the odds it’s all placebo effect? Zero.


ScepticsBane, Bad Astronomy 68 Comments [4/26/2011 5:30:51 AM]
Fundie Index: 80
WTF?! || meh
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timjamiller

So...scientists have researched it and say that it's placebo effect...and you tell us to wait until science researches it and says that it isn't. I think you fail at science forever.

4/26/2011 5:34:50 AM

Doubting Thomas

Can it possibly work and how?

The answer is no. The only thing drinking water is a cure for is thirst.

4/26/2011 5:37:02 AM

G.Syme

Gah. Just because YOU don't know what "quantum" means, doesn't mean others don't. Go sit in the corner with Deepak Chopra and the rest.

And the reason we don't rely on patients' testimony is because we know they're biased and unreliable. You didn't just out-think science, you twat.

4/26/2011 5:38:06 AM

G.Syme

Tim Minchin summed up homeopathy best: "While its memory of a long-lost drop of onion juice seems infinite, it somehow forgets all the poo it's had in it".

4/26/2011 5:39:09 AM

dionysus

Did you hear about the guy who overdosed on homeopathic medicine? He took so much that he drowned.

4/26/2011 5:46:46 AM



Neither side has the edge on deciding and there’s still those doctors and patients insisting that they benefited from it. What are the odds it’s all placebo effect? A Hundred to One.

4/26/2011 5:48:00 AM

The Jamo

Deepak Chopra, is that you?

4/26/2011 6:02:32 AM



"What are the odds it’s all placebo effect? Zero."

What are the odds that SepticsBane has any idea what "quantum phenomena" means? ABSOLUTE zero.

4/26/2011 6:04:54 AM



"How about lasers…are they possible?"

Fuckin' rainbows...

4/26/2011 6:09:56 AM

Argle Bargle

"Fuck your research and double blind studies, I've got speculation and logical fallacies at my disposal!"

4/26/2011 6:16:49 AM

Alleyprowler

Sometimes I wish I had fewer scruples. I could make a fortune off people like this.

4/26/2011 6:17:30 AM

tmarcl

So, more research has to be done by scientists and researchers, so long as it's not done by scientists and researchers?

4/26/2011 6:42:19 AM

muters

If, in the 1930's, someone claimed to be sending people to the moon, then yes, they would have been dismissed as talking nonsense. The fact that it later became possible is irrelevant, it's still nonsense until someone can scientifically prove it.

4/26/2011 6:42:55 AM

Mister SPak

"Who knows until scientists and researchers have had a go at it."

Um - aren't those the same people as the "bunch of frustrated lab nitwits up on their statistics and double blinded, randomized, placebo controlled “studies”?

4/26/2011 6:48:20 AM

gravematter

Albert Einstein established the theoretic foundations for the laser in 1917. Godard and Oberth, among others, wrote papers on space travel and rocketry pre-1930. Basic research.

"Who knows until scientists have had a go at it?" They have. They used "double blinded, randomized, placebo controlled “studies”." Or "science". The "real world" and "science" are far more closely linked than the "real world" and "pseudo-science". Plus to say that all "lab boffins" are just political pawns is spectacularly stupid. You're just regurgitating the "Big Pharma" bullshit - as if alternative medicine wasn't a multi-million pound industry itself, hardly "Small Pharma". And if you think that the occasional good results that homeopathy produces cannot all be the result of the placebo effect, then you've never studied the placebo effect, which is staggeringly powerful, and far more worthy of study for its biological and mental implications than the conclusively debunked homeopathy. Now it's time for you to go fuck a box jellyfish.

4/26/2011 6:54:28 AM

rallymodeller

Hey, know what they call alternative medicine that has been proven under scientific conditions?


They call it "medicine".

4/26/2011 6:57:05 AM

Papabear

"It seems to me that Homeopathy does work."

My nitwit detector tells me that I need read no further.

4/26/2011 7:18:52 AM

David B.

"What are the odds it’s all placebo effect?"

I don't know, but there's an easy way to tell. You set up a trial and randomly assign the subjects to one of two groups. The first group gets a genuine homoeopathic treatment, the other an identical sham treatment. But here's the important bit, you don't let either the patients or the people administering the test know which group anyone is in. That way any "placebo effect" should be equally strong in each group, since they and the experimenters should have equal expectations about the treatment, and any genuine effect of the homoeopathic medicine would become apparent, assuming it has any stronger effect than the placebo.

It's called the randomised, double-blind, placebo controlled trial and serves to eliminate the kinds of misleading results and personal biases you get from just asking the patients or their Doctors directly.

"Maybe the people to ask are the patients and their Doctors, instead of a bunch of frustrated lab nitwits up on their statistics and double blinded, randomized, placebo controlled “studies”."

FFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUU.........

4/26/2011 7:23:15 AM

Pule Thamex

Water is a tremendous natural medicine, it can cure so many things. It's healing properties are quite remarkable. About the only thing that it can't cure is gullibility or dumbo-brain. It's also acts as a fantastic natural money-spinner and is a superb wealth-enhancer.

4/26/2011 7:24:45 AM

Brendan Rizzo

I don't even understand this, but it's pretty clear that he fails statistics forever.

4/26/2011 7:26:39 AM

Gloria

Scientists and researchers have had a go at it, and have concluded it's a crock. You spent the whole first paragraph whining about it. Why are you now handing it back to them and expecting different results from thsoe you got the first several times around?

4/26/2011 7:26:59 AM

breakerslion

Why trust the Scientific Method when you can rely on anecdotal evidence supplied by people who are unqualified to differentiate between coincidence and causality? I ask you!

Test it again and keep testing it until your results agree with my preconceived faith-based beliefs.

Other things that were once thought to be impossible and have actual working parts work. Prove you need actual working parts! Maybe it's just coincidence! Prove that something with no actual working parts doesn't work. What burden of proof? Quackquackquackquackquack!

4/26/2011 7:27:24 AM

Doubting Thomas

@ anonymous #1282465

Neither side has the edge on deciding and there’s still those doctors and patients insisting that they benefited from it. What are the odds it’s all placebo effect? A Hundred to One.

I would say one to one. Controlled scientific studies do have the edge in deciding whether or not homeopathy (or anything else for that matter) really works. Homeopathic "medicine" is just plain water. They take a substance and dilute it down to where there is little if any of the original substance left in it. And contrary to every other substance on the entire planet, people pushing these "cures" claim that the more diluted and weak the "medicine" is, the more powerful it is. Meanwhile they're laughing all the way to the bank at the gullible idiots buying their snake oil.


4/26/2011 7:29:36 AM

Doctor Whom

Yeah, and those lab b0ffins can't explain how the tides work, either.

4/26/2011 7:37:06 AM

Anon-e-moose

"Can it possibly work and how? Can a rocket possibly carry men to the moon? How about lasers…are they possible? In the 1930's that would have been dismissed as nonsense."

Fucking Large Hadron Collider. How does it work?! [/Insane Clown Posse]

So water has 'memory' eh, homeopaths? When I - who works at a computer shop - start installing water RAM, and HD casings filled with water in all the repaired/upgraded/bespoke systems I work on, I'll let you know eh, ScepticsBane? [/sarcasm]

Oh, and as for homeopathy, and it's 'claims'? Yeah. I'll subscribe to said claims. When a homeopathic remedy can regenerate* a missing limb.

*- Several years ago, a Spanish woman had a replacement windpipe surgically placed, after a pioneering British technique was able to regenerate said tissue - from her own Stem Cells (taken from her own bone marrow). Neatly eliminated all the rejection problems arising from donated tissue/organs etc, and proved that Stem Cell research marches - and succeeds - inexorably on. Like I say, homeopaths, when you can come up with a 'remedy' that can surpass medical science in this way, then mayhaps you'll gain a shred of credibility. But until then, homeopathy is a load of bollocks - and that's all it'll ever be.

4/26/2011 7:47:19 AM
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