Tea Party Nation #fundie

Tea Party Nation #fundie rightwingwatch.org

[Re. Herman Cain's pledge to not hire any Muslim Americans unless they could prove their loyalty to the United States.]

What Joe McCarthy and the House Un-American Activities Committee did back in the day was insist on one simple idea. If you are going to work for the government of the United States, you are going to be loyal to the United States. The left did not like it then because so many leftists were communists and were in fact not loyal to the United States. It is a pity we do not have a loyalty test today, as that would instantly disqualify 95% of the Obama regime from holding the jobs they currently do.

Cain makes it clear this does not apply to other religions because other religions are not a threat. Only Islam tells its followers to make war against those who do not believe and to establish a theocracy.

We keep hearing that Islam is a religion of peace, but remember past conduct is the best indicator of future behavior. Islam has been at war with the West for 1400 years. Muslims are told they are to be at war with the unbelievers.

—

On this Cain is absolutely right. If we cannot prove you are loyal to the United States, you can do many things, but you will not work for the United States government.

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old comment by emau99

A couple of thoughts:

1) There's no religious test for elected office. You cannot exclude someone from government service on the basis of their faith. The US Constitution says so.

2) How exactly do you intend to prove that somebody is loyal to the US? What metric are you going to use?

3) Not all Muslims are radical. In fact, more Muslims than Christians have died fighting radical Islam...and then there's you, proudly pissing on their graves.

4) If you don't have a loyalty test, how do you know that "95% of the Obama regime" wouldn't pass it? You didn't just pull that out of your ass, did you?

It sounds to me that you're trying to screen government jobs so people you don't like can't get in.

That's tyranny.

old comment by Brain_In_A_Jar

If you are going to work for the government of the United States, you are going to be loyal to the United States.

What precisely do you mean by being loyal to the US? Do you mean loyal to the US government, or the US people, or its constitution, or the US land mass, or what? You specified government in the first mention of the US, but left the second ambiguous.

This is a crucial distinction; if the former, you leave no mechanism whatsoever to eliminate corruption from below; you rely entirely upon never getting a lunatic at the top of the hierarchy, and history shows that to be a foolish and naive arrangement (of course, if you're a fundie, you can say god is at the top and can never fail, and hence corruption at even the highest human level of government can still be fixed from above - not that this ever actually happens or even could happen). Whistleblowers and the like would be disallowed under that situation. If, on the other hand, working for the US government required only loyalty to the people of the US, or the constitution, the way is left open for the governed to fix the government from below when it gets broken. (funny thing - this is exactly the justification an awful lot of rightists and other McCarthy fanboys give for keeping their firearms, at the same time as demanding loyalty to the government they themselves reserve the right to fight against if they don't like it) This is why the constitution and bill of rights were written.

It's also why the HUAC were able to go after communists. It's not technically possible, if you're a strict, traditional communist, to support or engage with a non-communist government like that of the US (there are plenty of variant interpretations of communism that do not prohibit this, however. Democratic variants, for example, do not forbid forming a communist party within a parliamentary democracy and accepting non-communist rule when not currently incumbent). It's quite possible, however, to be a communist and still be loyal to the people of one's country, and even one's constitution, depending also upon the contents of said constitution. Indeed, loyalty to one's fellows is kind of a goddamn cornerstone of real communism.

Edit: Robespierre (the commenter, not the historical figure!) put it more succinctly.

old comment by Anon-e-moose

"What Joe McCarthy and the House Un-American Activities Committee did back in the day was insist on one simple idea. If you are going to work for the government of the United States, you are going to be loyal to the United States"

Yet, in all that time, how many actual Soviet moles were uncovered in all of McCarthy's bluff, bluster and bigotry against those who weren't exactly like him & his ilk, 100%? I'll tell you:

Zero.

However, poetic justice prevailed. In his desperation to root out supposed 'Reds under the bed', his increasing insanity based on his unjustifiable paranoia got the better of him, and he turned his eye towards the US military. Where said unjustifiable paranoia ultimately blew up in his own face. As a result, his political allies & backing in the GOP dried up. He was regarded as one would if a skidmark was found on a towel, and dropped just as quickly. He became an alcoholic. A nobody. He became the very thing he'd made, nay forced, thousands of innocent Americans into: a pariah. His FAIL was complete - with not a single Soviet 'agent' to show for his 'efforts'.

...on the other hand, here in the UK, there was the 'Cambridge Five':

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cambridge_Five

actual Soviet moles: Burgess, Philby, Maclean, Blunt & Cairncross.

With nary a peep out of anyone, nor bothering anyone, as they were exposed by MI6 & their operatives. The only time it came to the public's attention was when their trials were covered by the press. Even then, there was the evidence collated by MI6 etc, to make such an open & shut case. No unjustifiable 'paranoia' required.

Britain succeeds where the US FAILS. Oh, and today? For the last several years, MI6 have recruited people to investigate - and even infiltrate - Al-Qaeda cells here in the UK and abroad.

British Muslims.

I love the smell of annihilated arguments in the morning. Smells like... victory.

old comment by

“Naturally the common people don't want war; neither in Russia, nor in England, nor in America, nor in Germany. That is understood. But after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”

Herman Goering

Tea Party Nation #fundie rightwingwatch.org

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