Quote# 83503

Is heliocentricity an anti-Christian hoax and the "official" adoption of the Copernican model a slap in the face of established religion?
Astrology has for ages used the geocentric model with no problems so I think if there was a problem with it, the practitioners of astrology would have switched a long time ago.
Ptolemy came up with a good model based on what would have been good science of his day and it was used for a long time.
Most astronomers were resistant to the Copernican model when it came out.
Newtonian gravitation does not really work perfectly to describe the motions of the planets.
Galileo and the invention of the telescope are touted by the adherents of the Copernican model as the death nell to geocentrism but all it proved was that the inner planets, Mercury and Venus, orbit the sun, as can be deduced by the phases similar to what the moon experiences. Mercury is a small rock, and the large Venus is gaseous, so no great mass is required to hold them.
The earth has a very dense core and is enough to hold the sun, which is not much more than a hollow plasma field, in orbit.
Jeffrey Grupp is offering a $200 reward to someone who can prove that the earth orbits the sun and not the other way around. So there must be something to this, and people may want to rethink their notions about our world and the people living on it, who are the crowning achievement of God's creation and that we were put into the center of that creation.

jmdewey60, Above Top Secret 86 Comments [8/30/2011 3:39:03 AM]
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Old Viking

This is huge! Have you contacted Fox News yet?

8/30/2011 3:27:53 PM


@Doubting Thomas

We don't need to destroy Christianity. Christians are destroying it themselves with idiotic shit like this.

8/30/2011 5:06:18 PM


Above top stupid, more like.

8/30/2011 5:17:22 PM

Really? Really? The stupid is strong in this one. My 9 yo niece knows more about our solar system than this putz. sheesh.

8/30/2011 5:25:07 PM


Ptolemy may have been brilliant but he, like you are brilliantly WRONG!

As for Newton, apparently you come from a parallel universe in which Albert Einstein was never born.

Venus is not a gas-ball, you're confusing a volatile, corrossive, gassy atmosphere with a gas-ball.

Plenty of devoutly religious people have accepted the findings of Copernicus, Galileo, Newton, Darwin, Einstein, etc. with no problem for years & it has never shaken their faith & this stuff is a non-issue for them.

The Bible uses mythological language...Genesis is a metaphor, as is most of the Bible. It's mythology meant to teach spiritual & moral truths & to take it as 100% Literal & Historical is insane (not to mention all the questionable & downright horrific stuff often taught or portrayed within. The Gospels are the only parts of the Bible worthy of respect).

Finally, you are a dunderhead.

8/30/2011 6:23:52 PM


Genesis is a metaphor, as is most of the Bible. It's mythology meant to teach spiritual & moral truths

So attempting to cut your son's throat in a human sacrifice a la Abraham is somehow a spiritual and moral lesson if you think God tells you to do it? The picture of Abe wielding the knife was immediately after that of the dinos going into the ark in my 'Childrens' Bible', it freaked me out then and still does.

8/30/2011 11:11:22 PM


Just when I thought Fundies couldn't be any dumber... one comes along and proves me wrong.

8/30/2011 11:27:22 PM

My brain is melting from reading this.

8/31/2011 12:41:00 AM

Quantum Mechanic

The stupid, ignorant bullshit is strong with this one.

8/31/2011 12:45:35 AM

Percy Q. Shunn

8/31/2011 3:35:03 AM


There are numerous autonomous spacecraft in space right now confirming a heliocentric solar system...

It seems that it's not just the Earth's core that's very dense.

8/31/2011 3:59:26 AM


PROTIP: Astrology is not science.

8/31/2011 5:19:47 AM



Nooooo! Knowing someone would say this, I added "(not to mention all the questionable & downright horrific stuff often taught or portrayed within. The Gospels are the only parts of the Bible worthy of respect)". Like you, I find much of the actions of OT Bible-God totally deranged & would personally tell that Proto-Talibanish monster to CRAM IT! Keep in mind that Deity in the Bible has been depicted as either a crazed psycho dictator or a loving moral parent. The Gnostics were right concerning this, Loving Bible God is the Real McCoy & Monster Bible God is an impostor. You just have to separate the wheat from the chaff, so to speak. Now, if you don't believe in ANY Divine Power, that's fine by me. Deeds, not Creeds, define the true measure of a human. Spiritual people are not the problem, FUNDIES are the problem.

8/31/2011 5:37:18 AM

Argle Bargle

Sooo, Newtonian physics is a 300 year old hoax made to discredit Astrology out of all things?

This has got to be the most hilarious thing I've read on this site, and I've browsed it for two solid years.

8/31/2011 6:47:03 AM


Didn't we have this discussion in the 1600s?

As for Jeffrey Grupp, easy way to make $200. A fool and his money re soon parted.

8/31/2011 7:06:47 AM

God fucking damn it. Why there are idiots such as these?

He must've hitched a time machine pre Galileos birth and wound up here. These is no other god damn explanation for this stupidity.

And my grammar suffers due to b-b-b-rain damage.

8/31/2011 8:56:07 AM


The funny thing is in a way he's right. Picture it in your head and you realize for one thing to orbit another thing the thing it is orbitting has to also be orbitting it in turn.

The reason we use the heliocentric model is because it is the simplest model to chart and navigate the solar system with. As a consequence of the Sun have the most gravitational pull orbits are simpler from a heliocentric perspective.

If astrology was right then a geocentric model would work ONLY FOR ASTROLOGY. Because astrology is concerned with how energy from space impacts our lives on Earth. If you think about it it doesn't make sense that the energy we receive from space(even though the stars you see aren't presently in the locations you see them at, the light they emitted back then is presently at your location) would have absolutely no impact on our lives on Earth, but astrology as it is now has yet to prove any of their theories. The correlations of energy in space with what happens to energy(and therefore life) on Earth could be similar or way off from how traditional astrology explains it.

8/31/2011 9:26:44 AM


Apart from this clown, it would be interesting to see what real/other Christian fundamentalists have to say about this. It could turn out to be extremely amusing.

I'm just imagining Michele Bachmann at an interview being asked about her views on heliocentrism. I can hear her saying "Hell-io-what? Please don't use language that in mixed company, there are children present." ;-)

8/31/2011 12:20:37 PM

Pule Thamex

This is what happens to someone that neither has to struggle for food and water nor has to remove fired canon balls from flight and store them about their person. The luxury of harbouring the delusion that one is entitled to have ones views taken as seriously as the views of an educated person or an average human.

8/31/2011 12:55:00 PM


They did switch a long time ago, stupid.

The Earth is just a small rock too, stupid.

Prove that that "god" character of yours exists, then we'll talk.

8/31/2011 1:09:52 PM


Are you serious? The geocentric model? I don't understand, where in your stupid bible does it say "You must erroneously believe that the earth is the center of everything"? That was made up by stupid medieval europeans who wanted to believe that we're special. Nope, jmdewey, we're just a ball of rock held suspended BY THE SUN'S GRAVITY, just like many other similar balls of rock.

8/31/2011 2:04:33 PM


Astrology doesn't work with a geocentric model, it works with a subject-centric model. The calculations of the positions of the stars and planets are made from the perspective of the subject.

It still doesn't work, but you know, at least it explains itself better than you do.

8/31/2011 3:47:59 PM

The Jamo

only $200? Obviously this Jefrey guy isn't too committed to this reward of his.

8/31/2011 10:30:24 PM


"Jeffrey Grupp is offering a $200 reward to someone who can prove that the earth orbits the sun and not the other way around..."

Why thank you. You can add it to my re-useable money card.

9/1/2011 6:25:19 AM



jmderpy had better not read any of Sir Terry Pratchett's "Discworld" novels then, if he knows what's good for him.

Oh, and...:


...it's not turtles all the way down. Even LOLcats can move the Unmoved mover.

And for my next trick, solving Schrodingers Cat Paradox via the use of a tiny wireless video camera & light source, or making the box out of Perspex. [/smartarse]

A thought: is the above Ceiling Cat or Basement Cat? Now there's a paradox! X3

9/1/2011 8:26:44 AM

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