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Quote# 85220

[On why atheists can't join the Masonic Lodge]

The first conclusion is that Atheists are incapable of following God's Moral Law, and they are therefore incapable of meeting on the Square. the most often-quoted example of this comes from James Anderson in his Constitutions of Free-Masons (p. 50): "A Mason is oblig'd, by his Tenure, to obey the moral Law; and if he rightly understands the Art, he will never be a stupid Atheist, nor an irregular Libertine."

[...]

The effect of allowing Atheists entry into Masonry "would be to lessen confidence and weaken friendship, and no obligation would be regarded as binding among men ... Mankind would give way to the most unrestrained, cruel, and base passions of their worst natures. The very foundations of good order would be subverted, and society would soon degenerate into a state of anarchy." (Ernst, p. 69-70)

This is an even more prejudiced view than the view that Atheists cannot be trusted to uphold moral law, though there are connections between them. Anderson's reference to Atheists as "stupid" (meaning base, not of lower intelligence) implies the belief that non-believers are less of men. This, in addition to the aforementioned arguments, makes up the bulk of the arguments opposing the Atheist's admission to the Lodge.

Bro. Joshua L. Rubin, 32°, Pietre-Stones Review of Freemasonry 85 Comments [12/14/2011 12:47:19 PM]
Fundie Index: 58
Submitted By: Wykked Wytch
WTF?! || meh
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checkmate

Wow!!!

I can't become a Mason, I'm too old to become an astronaut, and my chances of winning the lottery are itsy bitsy tiny.

Life really is shit, isn't it? ;-)

12/14/2011 12:57:38 PM

Old Viking

As long as I'm welcome in the Loyal Order of Muskrats I don't need the Masons anyway.

12/14/2011 12:59:39 PM



Oh well, at least the sea otters will still take me.

12/14/2011 1:01:28 PM

Colgate

Posting this as typical Fundy sounds a little like bitching because you can't receive Catholic Communion because you're not a Catholic. What's the point?

12/14/2011 1:01:59 PM

Argle Bargle

Oh noes, I can't join your snooty social club.

Neener neener to you to, bub.

12/14/2011 1:02:29 PM

Bollox

I call that a lucky escape for atheists. Who needs the society of golf club bores?

12/14/2011 1:17:35 PM

breakereslion

"The first conclusion is that Atheists are incapable of following God's Moral Law,..."

True. One cannot follow that which doesn't exist. Morality is a human construct and a social compact.

"... and they are therefore incapable of meeting on the Square. the most often-quoted example of this comes from James Anderson in his Constitutions of Free-Masons (p. 50): 'A Mason is oblig'd, by his Tenure, to obey the moral Law; and if he rightly understands the Art, he will never be a stupid Atheist, nor an irregular Libertine.'"

Oh, where to start?

1. Non sequitur. Yes, I know what it means, but it is demonstrably untrue. Do you think for one minute you have not had "closet" atheists in your organization? Obviously they weren't so readily detectable.

2. Any statement or by-law with a word like "oblig'd" in it should be subject to immediate review. It dates to a time when they "hang'd" witches.

3. Which is more stupid, believing in an unprovable god without proof, or believing that the whole concept was made up by The Animal Who Lies?

As for the rest of your argument, the number of law-abiding, just, and merciful atheists living alongside you are proof that we do not suffer from Lord of the Flies Syndrome.

Your loss.

Edit: @ Old Viking - Whose turn is it to bring the duct tape? Oh wait, that's Possum Lodge. Forget you heard that.

12/14/2011 2:07:52 PM

TheJebusFire

["would be to lessen confidence and weaken friendship, and no obligation would be regarded as binding among men ... Mankind would give way to the most unrestrained, cruel, and base passions of their worst natures. The very foundations of good order would be subverted, and society would soon degenerate into a state of anarchy."]

You forgot: Rivers will run blood and nazis will once again ride dinosaurs!

12/14/2011 2:09:07 PM

Agahnim

Meh, I don't want to join your silly little club anyway.

12/14/2011 2:19:27 PM

Hertzyscowicz

So, all of this instead of just pointing out the "you gotta believe in a god to join" clause in the rules?

12/14/2011 2:27:42 PM

Brendan Rizzo

Why should we care about atheists joining the Freemasons? Do we WANT conspiracy theorists linking atheism with Freemasonry? They already connect it with Catholicism even though Catholics are forbidden to join, by Papal decree.

12/14/2011 2:44:28 PM

Wehpudicabok

@Colgate:

I'd say calling this:

"Mankind would give way to the most unrestrained, cruel, and base passions of their worst natures. The very foundations of good order would be subverted, and society would soon degenerate into a state of anarchy."

the natural result of atheism is pretty damn fundie. But I don't really care about the "you can't join our club" bit, either.

12/14/2011 3:38:08 PM

Pule Thamex

I love being base, or stupid, or atheistic as its sometimes referred to, apparently, because it means I don't have to "uphold God's moral law", or "behave immorally" as it's also sometimes put.

Mind you, to tell the truth, I do envy the way that non-atheists have with words, specially masonic non-atheists. Non-atheists seem to have an easy way with words' meanings. Wouldn't it be great if you could say, for instance, "uphold God's moral law" and not mean "be a deranged criminal egoist" but instead just mean "be a typically self entitled misogynistic bigoted oaf". Or it would be great to be able to say so-and-so is "base" and have "base" mean "stupid atheist who doesn't believe in an invisible genocidal maniac with super magic powers who particularly loves deranged white men of a certain ancestry".

Sigh! I guess there's something to be said for non-atheism after all.

12/14/2011 4:19:27 PM

tracer

I am an irregular Libertine AND I VOTE!

12/14/2011 4:30:32 PM

Skatepunk

Good! I may not be an atheist (yet), but I don't give a rat's ass about joining the Masons!

12/14/2011 4:42:02 PM

gaijinlaw

Fine, I won't join the Masons. That will leave me more time to do what I really want, become an adult leader for the Boy Scouts of America!
.
.
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Say what now? Shit!

12/14/2011 4:49:02 PM

Raised by Horses

(sniffles) Atheists are big, mean POOPY-HEADS!
-Ernst (Addendum)

12/14/2011 4:49:28 PM

JB Mason

Modern off-shoots of masonry (that stand a chance of having relevance in the 21st century) have accepted that "There is no god but Man."

12/14/2011 5:39:38 PM

Alencon

Why would I want to be a Freemason anyway?

It's not really high on my list of desires. As a matter of fact, I can't find it on the list at all.

12/14/2011 5:50:57 PM

LDM

Who wants to join your stupid club anyway?

12/14/2011 6:11:58 PM

aaa

To be perfectly honest, i don't give a shit about your over-rated organization. If i wanted to join a secretive society, i'd join something that actually bothers to get shit done and have productive discussion.

12/14/2011 7:02:30 PM



Fine, be a bigot. I wouldn't join an organization like that if you paid me.

BTW I've been told that the Moose Lodge allow atheists to join. Is that right? They seem like a cool group.

12/14/2011 7:07:34 PM

The Watcher

Fine, I don't want to go to your weekly sausage fest anyway. If I wanted to go somewhere women aren't allowed I'd go play in my kid's treehouse.

12/14/2011 8:54:30 PM

werewolf

Oh, good.

12/14/2011 9:10:14 PM

SomeoneYouKnow

Please the Masons are overrated, now the Stonecutters on the other hand are the best secret society!

Who controls the British crown?
Who keeps the metric system down?
We do! We do!

Who leaves Atlantis off the maps?
Who keeps the Martians under wraps?
We do! We do!

Who holds back the electric car?
Who makes Steve Gutenberg a star?
We do! We do!

Who robs cavefish of their sight?
Who rigs every Oscar night?
We do! We do!

12/14/2011 10:57:30 PM
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