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Quote# 85408

And the No. 1 abuse of homosexual activism in the United States in 2011, was the implementation of the repeal of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell," allowing open homosexual behavior in our military. No one can yet know how damaging the repeal of the ban on sodomy will be – we can only guess – but there's no question that it will damage the character of our armed forces and undermine their effectiveness. Dare I say the obvious? We need non-effeminate men in the military. Does anyone really believe that a prancing drill sergeant won't detract from readiness? Where women are serving, they should be women of high character, not those who embrace homosexual conduct and publicly declare a "sin" identity. These folks have truly lost their way, their shame, their innate sense of God's touch on and design for their lives.

Friends, this list is a call to action. We need to first understand the decline into barbarism that homosexual and sex-change activism brings. Then, we need to each be that person who gets it, who understands that these folks with their radical ideology are purposely endangering families, children, our nation's security, our economy and the religious freedom of all who don't go along.

God has warned us in the pages of Scripture that these sinful impulses will end in catastrophe. It's not true that this is just another way to love, but these activists, as you can see, intend to overturn the beauty of traditional sexual morality.

Please join me in pledging to speak out against this destructive agenda wherever possible during 2012.

Linda Harvey, Right Wing Watch 106 Comments [12/29/2011 4:17:21 AM]
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His4Life

Dr. Shrinker, what is your evidence that the person we saw was an actor? Obviously I can't prove that it was Jesus in the sense of making him appear again in a laboratory, but more than 500 people saw him that Sunday and were convinced that what they saw was real, including those who would be set against the idea that Jesus would show support for our pastor in this way. There were even atheists there, and we have five conversions that weekend.

If it was just a guy walking around in a costume (or someone I recognized as being a member of the church), obviously I'd be suspicious. My husband was very suspicious at first because he thought it might be a ploy to save Rev. Grinnell's job. However, there are some things we could not explain. No one saw the church doors open or where the Lord had entered and he walked in from a direction where there were no doors. The clincher though is that after he embraced our pastor, he turned, looked at the congregation with a sad face and then vanished in front of us. We all saw this. There was no smoke or lights or anything that would have hidden him; he was standing on the preacher's platform right in front of everyone and then in the blick of an eye he was gone - just faded out and vanished. Several of us when up to inspect the platform afterwards and there were no trap doors, hidden mechanisms, etc. Our own pastor was stunned and it was obvious he hadn't expected this to happen; he literally collapsed on a chair afterwards and was shaking and muttering to himself "oh my god, oh my god, I've seen him.... I've seen the lord...." How would you explain all of this if it was an 'actor?'

1/13/2012 9:50:05 AM

His4Life

Dr. Shrinker, what is your evidence that the person we saw was an actor? Obviously I can't prove that it was Jesus in the sense of making him appear again in a laboratory, but more than 500 people saw him that Sunday and were convinced that what they saw was real, including those who would be set against the idea that Jesus would show support for our pastor in this way. There were even atheists there, and we have five conversions that weekend.

If it was just a guy walking around in a costume (or someone I recognized as being a member of the church), obviously I'd be suspicious. My husband was very suspicious at first because he thought it might be a ploy to save Rev. Grinnell's job. However, there are some things we could not explain. No one saw the church doors open or where the Lord had entered and he walked in from a direction where there were no doors. The clincher though is that after he embraced our pastor, he turned, looked at the congregation with a sad face and then vanished in front of us. We all saw this. There was no smoke or lights or anything that would have hidden him; he was standing on the preacher's platform right in front of everyone and then in the blick of an eye he was gone - just faded out and vanished. Several of us when up to inspect the platform afterwards and there were no trap doors, hidden mechanisms, etc. Our own pastor was stunned and it was obvious he hadn't expected this to happen; he literally collapsed on a chair afterwards and was shaking and muttering to himself "oh my god, oh my god, I've seen him.... I've seen the lord...." How would you explain all of this if it was an 'actor?'

1/13/2012 10:02:37 AM

Dr.Shrinker

"Dr. Shrinker, what is your evidence that the person we saw was an actor?"

Occham's Razor, combined with the historical precedent I provided.

As for the rest of your story, I repeat what I said before, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. You have provided no evidence, therefore it is reasonable to conclude that you are lying, or that you have convinced yourself that some thing happened that did not happen. As for these alleged "500 people" who can verify your story, we have only your dubious testimony to the existence of these people.

We can conclude that you have nothing to promote your religion but an amusing folk tale. Oh yes, and those asinine threats that seem to stimulate your latent sexual fetishism. In short, you are a very poor witness for your faith.

1/13/2012 4:13:50 PM

His4Life

Ok, what kind of evidence are you looking for? Keep in mind we're on an internet forum; I can't take you to the spot and show where Jesus appeared or introduce you to the witnesses. However, I can ask some of them to come here and share their testimony if that would help. I can also scan and send you the church rolls from that week, which show more than 500 people in attendance, including five people who were saved that week. Not sure if anyone took pictures, but I might be able to find some - of course, you would just say they were fake.

1/14/2012 5:49:09 AM

Dr.Shrinker

Sock puppet accounts in which you repeat your story in a different voice are not evidence. Scans of your church rolls only suggest that certain people attend a certain church and have no bearing on your story. Pictures or film would have to be judged on their own merits, assuming they even existed, which you acknowledge is highly questionable.

In short, you admittedly have no evidence aside from your wild claims. You apparently came here assuming that we would believe your fanciful story based solely on your claim. Obviously, that did not happen. We questioned your assertions the same way we did when you tried to insist that the US was founded as a Christian nation or that Jesus did not celebrate the Hebrew Passover (or have you forgotten those conversations?)

You walked into a firefight brandishing a toy pistol. Now, if you want to save what might remain of your credibility you can find your own way out of this mess. Otherwise, I invite you to end this conversation in your standard way: by throwing out turgid fantasies of seeing us tortured forever by your god and slinking away to sulk.

1/14/2012 6:27:28 AM

Anon-e-moose

@Dr. Shrinker

More like a peashooter in a full-on DefCon-1 megaton-warhead ICBM exchange. Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life expects what she says to have any credibility, when there are so many fundies who would consider her not a True Christian™ for using anything other than the KJV (or QJV!).

Oh, and she thinks that the Bible she uses doesn't mention that part of Leviticus that the likes of her need to base their unjustifiable bigotry against LGBT people, nor if the Old Testament isn't included in said version she uses, and the New Testament makes absolutely no mention of condemning homosexuality - least of all by Jesus (who again, hung around with twelve men, two of whom were sailors. Was kissed by one of them. Didn't have a girlfriend, nor got married. And didn't wear a suit, nor did he have short hair, or shaved.), then she has absolutely no right whatsoever to be bigoted or show hatred towards anyone not heterosexual.

...but if her version of the Bible does have the Old Testament included in such, then again...:



...their reliance upon just one part of one chapter of such to justify their unjustifiable attitude to LGBT people, yet they choose to ignore the rest of the rules in such:

Matthew 5:18 (NAS): 'For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished'

Means that Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life will burn in Hell, despite her claims to be 'Saved'. And that's of course, before I mention her obvious, blatant & gratuitous mendacity here:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=74017&Page=3

And how such relates to Revelation 21:8 (NAS; emphasis added):

'But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death'

Like I say, No dearie, you are the Hellbound.

And then Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life was bumraped by demons for eternity.

...oh, and if her so-called 'God' is so reliant upon his 'believers' being so obsessed over that part of Leviticus (otherwise - like the rest of that section of the OT - they'd ignore that part), then he wouldn't have allowed it to be included. The fact he did - and especially in the KJV; the definitive, inerrant, consistent, flawless, perfect, inspired 'Word of God' so beloved of True Christians™ - shows how he is so far in his closet (like Ted Faggard), he is in Narnia, frolicking so gaily with Aslan & Tumnus, whilst wearing gold hotpants & a T-shirt with a homoerotic design by Tom of Finland on it. If God wants his 'believers' to be so obsessed about gays, then it proves he's infinitely more obsessed, and therefore gay himself. Otherwise, he wouldn't so much as give them - and their activities - a second thought.

And never mind what supposedly 'happened' in her church (to say nothing of that 'dove' her husband saw; in which case, why didn't anything 'Matrix'-like happened with that black cat which followed me home, pray tell...?!), such are the lies propagated by those who allow their minds to be warped by something worse than fiction:



Then the likes of those at Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life's church would be hammering the doors of the James Randi Educational Foundation (JREF) off their hinges, to demonstrate these 'miracles' under strict independent laboratory conditions (so that the processes in said 'miracles' can be analysed & potentially replicated by other 'non-faith' humans or even artificial electro/mechanical methods), then have the findings subjected to stringent peer-review, to prove they - and their 'beliefs' - are right, and claim his $1 million.

Otherwise, anyone can make spurious - and unprovable - claims about 'seeing' things. The phrase 'That which is asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence'. It exists for a reason.

As does one that I have: No evidencee, no believee.

Moral: If Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life - along with her so-called 'beliefs' & the book of fairytales such are based on - can't back up such claims with evidence to our satisfaction, then such have absolutely no right whatsoever to be acknowledged by us.

PROTIP: 'Just the facts, ma'am.' [/"Dragnet"]

...oh, and in b4 she comes out with her usual BS 'Turn or Burn' 'threats'. Because this is what the likes of her sound like whenever they do (after 1:00):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1_QlR_S8DU

Sounds ludicrous eh, dearie? As delivered by Al Murray (Pub Landlord)? Well, now you know how fucking stupid, insane, and unjustifiable anything you say sounds to the rest of we normal, sane people.

Least of all the likes of yours truly in the very secular, virtually Atheist UK. You do the maths, Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life.

Atheism + no fear of what'll never happen to us after we die = fundamentalist religion's FAIL. Therefore fundieism's slow, inexorable, inevitable death. And Fundamentalist Christian religion once had absolute rule over Europe, several centuries ago.

In summation: Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life is just like Bryan Fischite here:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=85574&Page=1

And so many like him: evil, unjustifiable bigots who masquerade as 'Christians' (when they're actually pseudo-Paulians; Paul, the Bible's own bigot & misogynist), to try and justify the unjustifiable: everything they say, do and think. Ergo, Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life = Fred Phelps. QED.

You know what to do, to eliminate that Fred Phelps-esque doctrinal & beliefs-based appelation (evil hyper-bigot): become as hyper-tolerant as the Quakers.

As Lloyd Bentsen said to Dan Quayle in a televised debate: 'Senator, I served with Jack Kennedy, I knew Jack Kennedy, Jack Kennedy was a friend of mine. Senator, you're no Jack Kennedy.'

I therefore put it to you, dearie:

I've worked with Christians. I know Christians; my best friend is a Christian. None of whom have anything against LGBT people whatsoever. Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life, you are no Christian.

And if ('If.' [/Spartan Laconic Wit]) I should be brought before your 'God' to be 'judged', all I'll have to do is say to him, 'After all you own crimes against humanity - including Hosea 13:16, Deuteronomy 2:34 & 3:6 - you've done enough. Have you no sense of decency, sir? At long last, have you left no sense of decency?'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army%E2%80%93McCarthy_hearings#Joseph_Welch_confronts_McCarthy



'I haven't killed anyone. Nor do I want to, ever. The 6th Commandment. God judge thyself. Matthew 7:1, and all that jazz.'

Then I'd point at him, and say with my more than infinitely superior morals intact: 'J'accuse!'

1/14/2012 12:49:55 PM

His4Life

Dr. Shinker, what kind of evidence would you like to look at? If I gave you the contact information for some of our church members who witnesses the event, would you find that compelling?

1/15/2012 9:50:02 AM

His4Life

Anonemoose, ok, so you believe you're more righteous than God? You're entitled to that belief. You can plead your case before God on when you come before the white throne and see just what he thinks of your "righteousness."

1/15/2012 9:58:41 AM

His4Life

If Quakers practice or accept sodomy in their churches, then they are not Christians. It's that simple.

1/15/2012 10:01:18 AM

Anon-e-moose

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=81077&Page=7

'Getting chewed out by someone on the internet is not "persecution." I am blunt and speak my mind. If it offends people, that is their issue, not mine'

Ahem:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=82219&Page=4

I refer you to this comment (emphasis added):

@LDM

"If that's all you can think about when it comes to gays, that's your problem."

I also refer you to the page after that (then scroll down). Either America has no concept of the Double-Entendre, or just that sign alone means that fundies in the US have no right whatsoever to dictate the rights & wrongs of anyone else's bedroom activities, least of all think they have the right to say that a 'gay agenda' exists. Which goes to prove that they have a closet-load of issues to deal with, before thinking they have the right to dictate what's right & wrong to anyone else.

http://mccannexposure.wordpress.com/2010/02/16/republican-list-of-paedophiles-shocking/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Alamo

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_evangelist_scandals

http://davidjstewartexposed.blogspot.com/

"I am blunt and speak my mind. If it offends people, that is their issue, not mine"

Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life is a sad loss to the diplomatic corps [/sarcasm]. Says so much about right-wing fundies, and how they're perceived by everyone else, compared to non-fundie faiths who don't have an 'issue' with things that fundies do. Thus Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life (and everyone like her) = Fred Phelps the hyper-bigot.

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=82006&Page=4

As per her 'assuming' that all anime is 'gay' (whereas I proved otherwise; and those I provided in my previous comment are just a few of many other examples of scenarios featuring heterosexual relationships between main characters in such), she puts forward the notion that Gwyneth Paltrow is married to Coldplay. As in the whole group of that name. Then she is called out on her stupidity clearly based on her own ignorance, and hearsay in the above thread. To say nothing of the fact that - unlike Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life - Gwyneth is proof that there are Christians who don't have a problem with LGBT people.

In summation: Not only does Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life have an unhealthy obsession (bordering on Faghag-ery) with the activities of LGBT people (otherwise - like others, including straight people like yours truly - she wouldn't care about what they do; the activities in private between adult consenting people, including 'Pride Parades', and perfectly fine & legal displays of LGBT culture thay are, if I do say so myself, which neither breals the legs nor picks the pockets of anyone), by the very fact they need co concentrate on just one part of the OT to justify their own unjustifiable anti-LGBT bigotry & attitudes (Fred Phelps & the WBC, and all that jazz) only serves to prove that - like Ted Faggard - God himself is obsessed about such people, and therefore is gay himself, otherwise he wouldn't have given what two people of the same sex do a second thought, and not even mentioned such in his 'Word of God', as he'd have realised that what two adult consenting people do is ultimately nobody's business but their own. And doesn't the Bible forbid busybodies? God condemn thyself!


...but also in the above thread (in which she claimed Gwyneth Paltrow was married to Coldplay), Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life clearly has a fetish for being proved wrong, nay, have her arguments completely annihilated. Notice how she was conspicuous by her absence in that thread after being called out in such, to try and defend her unjustifiable ignorance (again, as per her claim that all anime is 'gay'). Yet, she just keeps coming back for more. In threads that have absolutely no relevance to her whatsoever, least of all to the fundie being quoted; when - in a thread of a quote by her:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=68592&Page=1

...she is conspicuous by her own absence. Funny that. Least of all, the notion that an object consisting of wood pulp, ink, glue & cardboard can be an eyewitness...?



...oh no more, please Mr, Wilde, I am bereft of ribs! When a book can actually tell me - vocally - what happened to Jimmy Hoffa, Lord Lucan, Shergar & others who disappeared without trace, let me know eh, dearie? Oh, and I'm still to hear - vocally or in print in plain language - (no 'metaphor' bollocks allowed) - from your 'Bible' about what's the next format to come that'll replace Blu-Ray, seeing as it reveals so many 'true' prophecies about the 'future'*. [/hyper-sarcasm]

I'd like to see a psychologist figure out Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life. With aforementioned obsession about 'demonic buttsex', her constant need to mention such (especially in her insane 'threats' which she thinks anyone will listen to; I refer you to that YouTube link with Al Murray [Pub Landlord]), coupled with her obsession with what LGBT people get up to - which is nobody else's affair but said LGBT people; least of all to right-wing fundies (PROTIP: Ted Faggard, so fundie Christianity's not exactly got room to talk themselves). Then her need to constantly return here to spew what she thinks are her 'opinions' to anyone she thinks will listen to such, only to be called out on such, and have her right-wing Fundamentalist Christianity-based 'opinions' (and the underlying hatreds, bigotries & persecution of those she's talking about) proved wrong and torn apart, nay, completely annihilated, only exposes her own intellectual masochism. That, and her need to keep returning to FSTDT, when she knows that she'll get what she says reason-based & logically kerbstomped into oblivion which proves she is nothing more than a pathetic attention-seeker, displays a deep-seated & obvious mental handicap, would provide said psychologists with years of research material.

Fundamentalist religious 'faith' & 'belief. The ultimate mental handicap. But then, the likes of Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life put the 'mental' in Fundamentalist Christianity after all. And speaking of 'Mental'...:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=43974&Page=1

...along with the aforementioned Naughtygirl999 (with him seeing demons at his local McDonald's; also involving a bathtub & 'swords from hips' and all that jazz), Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life seeing things at her church, & her husband the bird spotter, should get together with 'Asylum.co.uk. in the above thread and compare notes. See whose 'stories are the more fantastical, and who can come up with a more credible 'miracle'. Yeah, that's the ticket. [/sarcasm levels at OVER 9000]

PROTIP: I bring to the attention of Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life what is said by Fanatic-Templar on page 2 of the above thread. So this commenter is correct about having in the garage an adult silver dragon called 'Shiny'...? Please consider extremely carefully that claimed by Fanatic-Templar, considering that claimed in that thread by Asylum.co.uk, Naughtygirl999 in the previous thread, and what you yourself & your husband 'claim' in this one, before answering. Especially taking into account the reason why the phrase 'Don't believe everything you read' exists. Oh, and before you do reply, also consider this notion: do you accept what Fanatic-Templar says - about a silver dragon called 'Shiny' in the garage - is fact? And if not, why not?

Your next words will determine just one of two outcomes:

1- If you reply 'Yes', that you do accept Fanatic-Templar's claim about having a silver dragon called 'Shiny' in the garage being fact - which Fanatic-Templar can never prove such a claim to be fact, expecting people to accept on spec (i.e. on 'faith'), and was lying, then everything you - including Asylum.co.uk , Naughtygirl999 & all other fundies - say is lies. Including everything you say about the Bible too. Remember: 'Don't believe everything you read', and all that jazz.

2- If you reply 'No', that you don't accept Fanatic-Templar's claim about having a silver dragon called 'Shiny' in the garage being fact, then equally everything you say, claim, whatever, has absolutely no right whatsoever to be acceped as fact by anyone, least of all we Atheists. Including everything you say about the Bible too. Remember: 'Don't believe everything you read', and all that jazz.'

The phrase 'That which is asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.'. It exists for a reason. Reason. You & your so-called 'religion' has none.

Reality - especially in a court of law - doesn't work purely on 'their word against mine', but on facts. Based on Evidence.

Facts fuck 'Faith'. Every time. Then you wonder why fundieism is dying, and Atheism's - certainly Secularism's - star is in the ascendant? Fundie religion once held absolute sway, centuries ago. But it's found wanting today. And people don't want it. Times change. Technologies change. Attitudes must change. The only beliefs allowed to exist - certainly in civilised democratic societies based on Rule of Law - are those which are hyper-tolerant (Civilised democracy fought against the hyper-bigoted, right-wing Hitler in WWII, to eliminate his attitudes that had no right to exist in the first place). Yours must adapt (like the Quakers, Buddhists, Sufi Muslims & Unitarian Universalists have) - or die. They've certainly become all but extinct here in Europe. Good. The only thing we don't tolerate is intolerance. Five words: Fred Phelps. Westboro Baptist Church.

Your time, fundies - as the dominant paradigm - is over. Your light is dying. As it was with the exact same unjustified, bigoted attitudes before the Civil Rights movement, pre-Rosa Parks - and what happened afterwards. NAACP and ACLU ring any bells?

As it is with the new Civil Rights Movement today, re. LGBT people (emphasis added):

'It is like a monster: if you walk by it quietly enough, it will only lift an eyelid and sniff at you. But if you awaken it...!'

-Kenneth Aubrey (Freddie Jones), "Firefox"

One word: Stonewall.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stonewall_riots

You - and your so-called 'beliefs' & 'Faith', and what such are based on - is running out of credibility (if you - and said book of fairytales - ever had any in the first place). To quote Dr. Shrinker: 'The ball is in your proverbial court miss.'

PS, Dr. Shrinker: Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life had better not watch the film "The Invention of Lying", if she & her husband - and her claims that what they 'saw' happened - know what's good for them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Invention_of_Lying

...oh, and as for:

"ok, so you believe you're more righteous than God?"

My dear, I don't need to 'believe'...:

'The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control freak ... homophobic, racist, ... capriciously malevolent bully.'

-Richard Dawkins

People killed:

God: 2,038,344

Satan: 10 (and only then only on God's specific authorisation)

Anon-e-moose: 0

'After all your own crimes against humanity - including Hosea 13:16, Deuteronomy 2:34 & 3:6 - you've done enough. Have you no sense of decency, sir? At long last, have you left no sense of decency?'

...I know.

The ultimate truth of the Bible: Lucifer (if he exists) is actually the good guy in all this. I see absolutely no evidence to the contrary in the Bible. Great advertisement for Satanism, fundie Christians.

*- Yeah. 'Revelation' in what it 'claims' in plain language, with no 'artistic licence' or metaphor bollocks, is sooooo concise in what it says, that Crystal Mark award from the Plain English Campaign is winging it's way, yessiree! [/mega-sarcasm]

1/16/2012 8:26:35 AM

Dr.Shrinker

@ His4Life

Your utter refusal to comprehend the subtleties of the notion of "Burden of proof" is really starting to annoy me.

No, referring me to members of your church would NOT constitute evidence for your claims. The members of your church are not disinterested parties. It is safe to assume that they are just as interested in pushing your version of the party line as you are. An untruth, told by one person or 500, is still an untruth.

Earlier, I accurately predicted that you would discount my explanation that your so-called manifestation was staged by "recalling" the miracles that the alleged manifestation performed. I now predict that you will play the wounded party and say, "Well I tried to offer proof but you refused to accept it." Your pouting will, of course, convince no one but yourself. But then, it seems that you do not post here for any other purpose than the feeding of your own ego.

Before I go, let me state that I am not being overly harsh on you. This is the kind of skeptical scrutiny that anyone who makes an assertion about sensible reality would have to face if they were trying to get their work published in a scientific journal, whether they were speaking about religious manifestations or not. You can add your name to the immense list of believers who thought they had objective proof of their conception of a deity, and failed to produce results.

1/16/2012 9:04:39 AM

Anon-e-moose

@Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life

"If Quakers practice or accept sodomy in their churches, then they are not Christians. It's that simple."

Before 2006, this man held such sway in Evangelical circles in the US, he even had the ear of George Dumbya Bush on a regular basis. His opinion had power, nay, his word was almost law:

"We don't have to debate about what we should think about homosexual activity. It’s written in the Bible."

-Ted Faggard



The rest, of course, is history.

Still not seeing that McCarthy-esque purge of hypocrites in your churches over there; Ted Faggard can't have been the only one in your ranks. How many more are there, whose public face of being 'married', and living a moral, 'Christian' lifestyle is nothing more than a sham? You tell me, dearie. Like I say, I don't see any ultra-extreme witchhunts & showtrials (on a 'guilty until proven innocent' basis; those poor people who were victims of the Salem witch trials were given the same 'due process', resulting in their murder).

...ah but of course, if such a campaign was initiated, to completely eliminate all 'unrighteous' elements from your ranks, both pastors & congregations, there'd be no right-wing Fundamentalist Christianity left in the US.

The phrase 'Put your own house in order'. As in before you think you have the right to condemn the activities of others, make sure you are completely sinless; 'Let he who is without sin cast the first stone' and all that jazz.

So right-wing Fundamentalist Christianity is completely sinless, therefore it thinks it has the right to be judgemental about LGBT people...?:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Alamo

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_evangelist_scandals

http://davidjstewartexposed.blogspot.com/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/26/AR2006122600847.html

...oh but of course the victims (even underage ones) were of the opposite sex, so I guess that makes it alright, doesn't it?! So you just keep on condemning those vile, satanic, heathen homosexuals, who commit such unforgivable sins that are between adult consenting people; doing absolutely no harm to anybody else, unlike the above sinless, 'saved', righteous heterosexual nen of God. Just one of whom is doing no harm to the cause of spreading God's word. [/hyper-sarcasm]

PROTIP: Unless I'm wrong, wasn't the one who the 'Holy Ghost' (and therefore God himself' the 'Trinity', and all that jazz) impregnated - Mary - a child bride...? So I guess that's why you never see paedophilia condemned in the Bible; unlike homosexuality in the OT, of course. Oh, what two adult men do is wrong, but statutory rape - as long as the victim is of the opposite sex, well...!

And then we in FSTDT wonder why we get so many quotes from fundies who claim that rape is okay - because the unborn child conceived as a result of the unwanted, unjustified attentions of the woman's attacker takes priority over the rights of the poor woman who has had such an unjustified pregnancy forced upon her in this way. Yet, the Bible never condemns abortion. As evidenced by Hosea 13:16.

The way the charges are racking up, it seems your very fundieist religion - and the book such is based on - is losing the battle against modern, democratic - and secular-based civilisation, based on Rule of Law. Certainly not Theocratic dictatorial tyranny, such as Sharia law - or what Dominionist Christians would like to impose on everyone (PROTIP: Hitler was a Christian; 'Gott Mit Uns', and all that jazz). Thus, like I say, Your time, fundies - as the previous dominant paradigm - is over. Your light is dying.

As evidenced above, when right-wing Fundamentalist Christianity allows sex crimes - rape, adultery (Jimmy Swaggart), statutory rape - even paedophilia in it's ranks, Then it has no right to exist, let alone think it has the right to dictate morality to anyone else. It's that simple.

Unless you & your ilk start to clean house, purge the unrighteous from your own ranks and so on. Even if - to make yourselves purer than all we heathen 'sinners' out there - it completely annihilates right-wing Fundamentalist Christianity as a whole.

And of course, you can start with yourself, the liar:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=74017&Page=3

Remember that 9th Commandment: Thou shalt not bear false witness against your neighbour. Also, don't forget:

Revelation 21:8 (NAS; emphasis added): 'But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death'

To quote Dr. Shrinker: 'The ball is in your proverbial court miss.'

...oh, and Dr. Shrinker, in b4 her being reduced to the usual 'threats', which not only destroys her own argument, as threats are the last resort of those who know they've lost the argument (if her argument ever existed - or had the right to exist - in the first place), then it proves that she - and everything she says now & in perpetuity - has the credibility level of this fundie:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=85627&Page=1

Zero. And that's being generous on my part, dearie. It's the most your so-called 'beliefs' deserve.

PROTIP: about 12 years ago, I had a tumour removed from my rectal wall, in a procedure that was textbook, as the chief surgeon told me; it was the first operation the particular anaesthetist had performed, and the surgeon praised him on making my operation completely painless, he couldn't have wished for a better person for such (he's now a consultant anaesthetist, with his own private practice, along with his own practice as a conventional physician).

That anaesthetist is my physician, one of the nicest, most intellectual and learned medical practitioners one could possibly meet. He's a Sufi Muslim. And that tumour that I had removed from me so skilfully by said surgeon, and painlessly by my physician/anaesthetist? It was benign. Thus I refer you to my comment in that thread, re. my role model Lance Armstrong. And the equally credible 'threat' from that fundie:

"For those who do not believe him and mock his message, Weinland claims that they will die from cancer."

Yeah. His 'threat' has as much credibility as your 'demonic buttsex for eternity' one, Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life... how? You tell me. Like I say in that thread, 'Ever heard the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf"?'

Former cancer-threatened Atheist Lance Armstrong's superiority levels are OVER 9000. Your threat levels, dearie? Zero.

How can we be threatened by something that doesn't fucking exist? You tell me - least of all Lance Armstrong? You and your so-called 'beliefs' are worse than pathetic. Indeed...



...they're a fucking joke. And that's all they'll ever be. Ergo, FSTDT. After all, and certainly in relation to your 'claims' of seeing things in church:

'The only way to combat ridiculous propositions is through mockery'

-Thomas Jefferson

And what can be more ridiculous than your propositions about claims that are completely baseless - certainly in a court of law, least of all to James Randi's JREF?

As I say: No evidencee, no believee. Ergo, Atheism. Q.E.and D., bitch.

Re. the original point:

"If Quakers practice or accept sodomy in their churches, then they are not Christians. It's that simple."

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=71725&Page=3

@Observer

"You realize those "christian" denominations are all viewed as r fringe groups as their teachings divert radically from all other denominations right? So whats your point?"

Considering the thousands of denominations that call themselves Christian, and how so many True Christians™ are KJV-onlyists, who regard any other form of the 'Word of God' as nothing less than heresy - and would consider those who use, say, the NAS as not Christian - where does that leave you and what you say/do/think/believe, compared to said KJV-onlyists? Who's right? Who's wrong?

You tell me, dearie. If said KJV-onlyists consider you as not Christian, but the Amish are - who are just as hyper-tolerant as the Quakers. The Amish use the KJV too.

I bring to your attention the following page in the above thread:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=71725&Page=4

Specifically the comment by Microraptor.

So why aren't the Amish - or the Quakers - quoted here in FSTDT, dearie. And the likes of you are...?:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=68592&Page=1

You tell me.

And now you know why FSTDT exists. The phrase 'Those who don't want their beliefs laughed at shouldn't have funny beliefs'. It exists for a reason

The Amish, Quakers, Buddhists, Sufi Muslims, Unitarian Universalists, Wiccans & their ilk, I have absolutely no problem with. They have no need to force their beliefs upon anyone else, least of all insinuate themselves into the political system to equally force their beliefs-based morals upon those who don't want them in the first place. Why Should they? They are secure in their faith.

Therefore they don't get quoted here in FSTDT, least of all pointed & laughed at by anyone else in - or out of - the internet. Because they are theists who are respected. They don't bother anyone, they're not bothered by anyone. Their beliefs exist. They always will. I hope they do. Not being 'fundie' hasn't killed them. So would it kill you fundies to be exactly like the Amish, Quakers, Buddhists, Unitarian Universalists, Sufi Muslims or Wiccans: hyper-tolerant?

You. Tell. Me.

"If Quakers practice or accept sodomy in their churches, then they are not Christians. It's that simple."

(emphasis added):

'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'

-Mohandas K. 'Mahatma' Gandhi

Remember: in the New Testament, Jesus didn't say word one about condemning homosexuality.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_evangelist_scandals

If fundies like Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life accept, nay allow perversion & sin to exist in their own ranks, and do nothing about the elimination of such (for fear of being counter-accused of hypocrisy, re. their own judgemental attitudes towards others not exactly like them) - even if, in the process of such elimination, their own religion is exterminated - then they have absolutely no right whatsoever to so much as contemplate the notion of even thinking that they have the right to be judgemental about the activities of anyone not exactly like them; Matthew 7:1, and all that jazz. It's that simple.

Enjoy your paradox, dearie.

1/19/2012 8:30:01 AM

His4Life

And Ted Haggard is going to hell unless he repents or changes his lifestyle. What is your point? I never endorsed Haggard or said he represented authentic Christianity. He was a fake - a wolf in sheep's clothing.

1/20/2012 10:06:48 AM

Anon-e-moose

@Troll/Poe/Nuts4Life

Good, good. You've admitted one hypocrite exists in your ranks. That's a start. One down, millions more hypocrites to go...:

http://www.fstdt.net/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=74017&Page=3

...including yourself, the 9th Commandment-breaking liar (and you have no right to claim you're 'Saved', neither, giving you carte blanche to be a douchebag cunt towards everyone else. Remember Jesus to Mary Magdalene after forgiving her: 'Go and sin no more').

Revelation 21:8 (NAS; emphasis added): 'But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death'

And you are going to Hell, unless you - and every fundie who thinks they have the right to be judgemental about anyone else (when you don't; Matthew 7:1, and all that jazz) change your judgemental attitude and your fundie lifestyle to that of the non fundie faiths (Amish, Quaker, Buddhist, Unitarian Universalist, Sufi Muslim & Wiccans): hyper-tolerant.

Your point?

1/21/2012 11:08:09 AM

His4Life

Anonemoose, of course there are millions of hypocrites in the church - this was even predicted in the Bible. Remember Judas Iscariot, history's first hyocrite? There's nothing new under the sun, as Ecclesiastes says. Fortunately, my faith is not based on fallible men or on my own righteousness - which we both know is flawed and inadequate. I fully admit that I am a sinner and that left to my own devices, I'd have no hope of salvation. Fortunately, I am HIS for life, not MINE for life or Ted Haggard's for life. I belong to the one who is flawless and perfect - the one able to lead me to salvation and save me from my own hypocrisy and sinfulness.

Anonemoose, I'm curious - looking beyond His flawed and sometimes insincere followers, what do you think of Jesus? Do you believe He was a hypocrite? If so, can you show me where he lied or did something hypocritical?

1/21/2012 8:14:28 PM

His4Life

Anonemoose, of course there are millions of hypocrites in the church - this was even predicted in the Bible. Remember Judas Iscariot, history's first hyocrite? There's nothing new under the sun, as Ecclesiastes says. Fortunately, my faith is not based on fallible men or on my own righteousness - which we both know is flawed and inadequate. I fully admit that I am a sinner and that left to my own devices, I'd have no hope of salvation. Fortunately, I am HIS for life, not MINE for life or Ted Haggard's for life. I belong to the one who is flawless and perfect - the one able to lead me to salvation and save me from my own hypocrisy and sinfulness.

Anonemoose, I'm curious - looking beyond His flawed and sometimes insincere followers, what do you think of Jesus? Do you believe He was a hypocrite? If so, can you show me where he lied or did something hypocritical?

1/21/2012 8:16:13 PM

His4Life

Anonemoose, of course there are millions of hypocrites in the church - this was even predicted in the Bible. Remember Judas Iscariot, history's first hyocrite? There's nothing new under the sun, as Ecclesiastes says. Fortunately, my faith is not based on fallible men or on my own righteousness - which we both know is flawed and inadequate. I fully admit that I am a sinner and that left to my own devices, I'd have no hope of salvation. Fortunately, I am HIS for life, not MINE for life or Ted Haggard's for life. I belong to the one who is flawless and perfect - the one able to lead me to salvation and save me from my own hypocrisy and sinfulness.

Anonemoose, I'm curious - looking beyond His flawed and sometimes insincere followers, what do you think of Jesus? Do you believe He was a hypocrite? If so, can you show me where he lied or did something hypocritical?

1/21/2012 8:21:24 PM

Dr.Shrinker

"I am HIS for life, not MINE for life or Ted Haggard's for life."

By "HIS" you obviously mean your pastor, the one who filled your head with pagan imagery cloaking it in language of the bible.

Face it, with each post you become more and more transparent. I was able to predict your last two moves in our recent debate: one of which you followed to the letter and the second you avoided by dropping the debate entirely. I think its time for you to admit that you have nothing to offer us here: nothing but lies about your experiences, lies fed to you by your pastor, and biblical references you don't even vaguely to understand.

So why are you still presuming that you have something to offer us?

1/21/2012 8:38:31 PM

His4Life

Nope, I mean Jesus, not my pastor. My pastor is also "His (Jesus') for life," and as long as he is, I will gladly follow his leadership and guidance, although I test everything he says against scripture and will challenge him when I disagree with something. The day my pastor deviates from following Christ is the day I deviate from him, though and that is a basic expectation in our church - everything is weighed against the teachings of Jesus before we accept it as truth. What do you weigh your opinions and beliefs against?

1/21/2012 10:26:55 PM

Justanotheratheist

You'd think that Jesus appearing in person in front of 500 people might just make the news, especially in Jesus-mad America. Funnily, I have seen no reference that even the ridiculous Fox News picked up on this.

But then religion thrives on the very fact that the religious will and do believe absolutely any shit that they want to believe. The oft-quoted fact that what their God seemingly wants always bears an uncanny resemblance to what they themselves comes to mind.

Is it god who doesn't want gays protecting his ass if the need arises, or is it really just you and your fellow fundies, Linda, honey?



1/22/2012 2:33:45 AM

His4Life

We did approach several local papers with the story, but none of them would carry it. They have a distinctly anti-Christian bias. I didn't think of going to Fox News, but I doubt they would have picked it up.

1/22/2012 10:06:59 AM

Dr.Shrinker

@ His4Life

"We did approach several local papers with the story, but none of them would carry it. They have a distinctly anti-Christian bias."

And you thought your BS story would fly here at FSTDT? Okay, I am convinced that you are nothing but a lying troll, and no longer worth communicating with.

Good day

1/22/2012 11:38:18 AM

His4Life

I could give you the names of the papers and reporters who were aware of the story but chose not to cover it.

1/22/2012 1:51:30 PM

His4Life

Here is the press release that our church prepared to submit to the local papers. It contains several quotes from individual eyewitnesses. I removed our church's name just because I don't want it circulating on the internet:

A Visit From the Lord: Jesus Christ Visits Local Church, Offers Encouragement

[Deleted] Community Church is used to special visitors. Last summer, they welcomed Jake Chandler, a missionary to the remote steppes of Mongolia, and recently hosted a three-day conference for African-American church leaders from throughout the state that drew respected authors and speakers from the black Charismatic movement. But nothing could have prepared the congregation for the divine visitor they received Sunday, March 22, when following the congregation’s weekly worship service church members and visitors reported seeing Jesus Christ appear to offer encouragement to the embattled church.

“He was just there all of a sudden.” Fifteen-year old Martina Jessica Daniels reported. “A lot of us in the youth choir saw him; so did our parents. We’ve got no doubts that what we saw was real.”


1/22/2012 3:42:45 PM

His4Life

The man, described by congregants as a dark-skinned, middle-aged man in a burlap robe and sandals, entered the sanctuary around 11:00 am, just as Reverend Christopher Jay Grinnell was pronouncing the benediction at the close of the service. Grinnell had come under fire after the church filed for bankruptcy last year and a congregational meeting was scheduled for later in the day to discuss the possibility of closing the church.

“We were asking a lot of Pastor Grinnell.” Church member Lois DuBois said. “We were looking for someone to take the blame for what happened, and a lot of us turned on him.”

The man identified as Jesus walked down the aisle of the church in front of more than five hundred worshippers and approached the pulpit, where he embraced the trouble reverend and held him for more than a minute. Church members report that the man then vanished.

“It was wild,” Deacon John Carlyle said, eyes still sparkling with excitement as he recounts the story. “I mean, he was there - and then he weren’t there. Just like that.” He snaps his finger to illustrate his point, then looks quietly at the ceiling as he grapples with his thoughts. Finally he speaks in a quiet voice still raw with emotion.

“It changed a lot, I think. It gave us hope. It helped rekindle our passion for our mission here and helped us see beyond the battles we were fighting. A whole bunch of us went up to Pastor Grinnell afterwards and said let’s fix this, let’s start again and work together for the sake of this ministry.”


1/22/2012 3:44:08 PM
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