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A most aptly named meathead.
4/15/2012 3:14:48 AM
I still don't understand why Americans of a certain affiliation (ahem) react in such a terrified manner to the idea of the government actually doing its job.
4/15/2012 3:15:52 AM
Blue the Thief
4/15/2012 3:19:41 AM
Jonny boy, the Healthcare Mandate does not expand governmental control over the individual, it expands regulation of the health insurance industry (of course the rethugs watered down some of the measures).
And by the way, why do you hate us British? Roastbeef is a derogatory term used by the French towards the British. It's not strictly racist, but it's damn close...
4/15/2012 3:24:04 AM
HEY, AMERICA!! We here in Europe, and Australia, and Canada, have had free or affordable healthcare for decades, and it is not "governmental control over the individual". It is a basic standard of cvilization which generations of people have fought and worked hard for.
Under your system, in the wealthiest country in the world literally millions of people have no health insurance, while there is simultaneously an absolutely massive imbalance of wealth at the top.
And we're the morons?
4/15/2012 3:47:49 AM
Right, because it would be such a terrible thing for the government to make you a healthy person.
4/15/2012 4:07:40 AM
Because of the intensity of the 30+ years of right-wing brainwashing and the GOP's 24/7 barrage of misinformation that started with Ronald Reagan, who said idiotic things like, "The nine most terrifying words in the English language are "I'm from the government and I'm here to help".
4/15/2012 4:50:27 AM
There was an article in The Onion a while back about a man who argued for what he believed to be in the constitution rather than what was in it. Yes, the phrase "life liberty and the pursuit of happiness" are in the DoI, but this guy obviously hasn't read past the preamble of the constitution.
There's all sorts of things the government makes us do or forbids us from doing. Some might seem silly but they're all for the collective good. Stopping at red lights comes to mind as a good, yet simple example.
So here's the deal I would propose to anyone who wants to get rid of Obamacare: if you either can't afford insurance or lose it for any reason and you get sick, your choices are to pay for your care yourself, or go without care. If that kills you or seriously exacerbates your malady, you lose all legal recourse to remedy it.
4/15/2012 4:52:18 AM
Yeah, because the government can only kill you, imprison you, take your money (and use it to kill other people, preferably brown people), spy on your every move, and place the rights of corporations and fetuses over the rights of living, breathing human beings.
But Celestia forbid the government make healthcare more affordable for the literal tens of millions of people who don't have it, people it is supposed to protect.
"So here's the deal I would propose to anyone who wants to get rid of Obamacare: if you either can't afford insurance or lose it for any reason and you get sick, your choices are to pay for your care yourself, or go without care. If that kills you or seriously exacerbates your malady, you lose all legal recourse to remedy it."
Uh... that's exactly the situation they have now. Or were you making a joke? If so, not enough time has passed to make that tragedy finny.
4/15/2012 4:55:23 AM
My ancestors came from Europe. Judging by the fact that you're a wingnut, since wingnuts hate non-WASPs, yours probably did to. Do not insult Europe; they know what they're doing and we could learn from them.
4/15/2012 5:11:04 AM
Filin De Blanc
Why exactly is the idea of the government helping people not die so Celestiadamn controversial?
4/15/2012 5:34:40 AM
@Extraintrovert, that's not really the situation we have now. Emergency rooms are prohibited by law from denying people care because of their ability to pay.
I'm not trying to make a joke. I'm saying that if we truly want to get people to demand reforms -- ones that'll actually do more than Obamacare proposes -- then maybe we've got to let things get worse first. I don't want to sound harsh or unfeeling but if that's how the conservatives want to play it…
4/15/2012 5:50:04 AM
Not at all fundie.
4/15/2012 7:00:58 AM
I quite like roast beef, so I can only take as a compliment to us Brits :D
4/15/2012 7:42:44 AM
I'm impressed, he got the document right. Most of these idiots fuck it up and think that line is in the constitution.
If they wanted limited federal governmental power, we would have stuck with the Articles of the Confederation. The Constitution actually gave a lot of power to the government that it didn't have before.
4/15/2012 8:32:45 AM
Eh....while it's fundie, there are some points to be found in it.
The Health Care Reform Bill is not universal health care. It's mandatory insurance. There are stipulations that insurance companies have to abide by, but making health care affordable isn't one of them. The bill is counting on the free market to drive premiums and costs down.
As someone who lives in Massachusetts, I've had to deal with this same program for years, created by Mitt Romney, no less. We have mandatory insurance and no costs have gone down due to the market. My premiums have still consistently gone up, as have my deductibles. Now, we even have a new thing called "co-insurance" which the insurance companies created which forces people to pay up to half the cost of a procedure even after the deductible. These programs do nothing to address the basic issues of insurance companies having carte blanche to make up whatever rules they want, and I see little fix of that in the Health Care Reform bill.
If people want to complain about fundies overblowing the situation, then fine, but I wish people would stop referring to the bill as universal health care or something similar, because it's not. I've been there and still am.
4/15/2012 8:57:30 AM
From my point of view, it seems like this "reform" is a massive expansion of corporate control over the individual, not governmental.
If you're against the government controlling people's lives, then you're obviously against Prop 8 and other laws prohibiting gay marriages, and you are of course pro-choice. Right?
4/15/2012 10:00:30 AM
God, these fucking people. I can't stand it any more. See, America? This is what happens when you have outrageous, sickening wealth inequality leading to an isolated plutocrat-class which uses every corrupt political practice in the book to literally buy off an entire party of a two-party state and use that position to both demand and enable extremism through a 3-decade-long campaign of lying and misinformation. How else could you have a fucking DEPRESSION be caused by their leeching and rampant Republican deregulation, only for that to be turned around and make the outrageous claim that it was the DEMOCRATS' fault and the solution is MORE DEREGULATION AND MORE PARASITISM, funded by letting the poor starve and the middle class become poor?! It defies belief!
America, this is what happens when you let bullshit lie out in the open and you don't call them on it. It's time to stop being lazy, weak, spineless or GOD FORBID "politically correct" before this onslaught against our traditional way of life. You already know what to do: vote progressives into office.
4/15/2012 10:24:58 AM
Yes, health care reform would make America more like Europe.
The Europeans are actually *doing well* with their health care.
4/15/2012 10:41:59 AM
You know, Jonny, if people reviewed what they write and think about it before posting, things like these would be a thing of the past.
4/15/2012 11:32:11 AM
Oh, and by the way, it's in the Declaration of Independence that Americans are afforded the opportunity to seek out 'life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness' on their own, not the Constitution.
That's right, cuss out furreners for not knowing the fine print of American history.
Btw, can you, Jonny Roastbeef, find London and/or Madrid on a map without assistance? Probably not. Oh fuck, can you even find New York, Chicago, or Dallas on a map without assistance? I'd put down money that you can't.
Oh, by the way, how many languages do you speak? Only one? Most Europeans can speak two or more. Most Africans can speak three or more.
4/15/2012 11:58:53 AM
Not fundie, there's no religion in it and a few actual facts.
That said, I don't think the health care bill violates anything in the constitution. I just don't like the forced participation in a privatized business.
4/15/2012 12:29:46 PM
More like Johnny Spoiledbaloney.
4/15/2012 12:52:27 PM
The healthcare bill was designed by Rube Goldberg on LSD.
4/15/2012 1:41:56 PM
Likewise, Mr. Roastbeef. Is that your given name?
4/15/2012 2:47:08 PM
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