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Quote# 87044

[A Muslim group in Germany is distributing free copies of the Koran. Their goal is "a Koran in every house".]

A spokesperson for the Berlin branch of the BfV [the German intelligence agency] told Die Welt that "the objective of this campaign is to help bring those who are interested into contact with the Salafist scene in order to influence them in the context of their extremist political ideologies."

Although not everyone who takes a Koran into their home will convert to Islam, German authorities say Abou-Nagie's Project "Read!" is a establishing a breeding ground for anti-constitutional ideas[...]

The head of the German Police Union (DPolG), Rainer Wendt, has told the Hamburg-based Bild newspaper that he is concerned about the presence of clandestine Islamic sleeper cells made up of Muslim immigrants and converts in Germany. He has called for the recruitment of undercover agents to infiltrate the Islamic environment. It is the "only way to monitor the scene," Wendt said.

"Radical Islamists live everywhere and nowhere in Germany. One cannot rule out that that nice young man from next door, who brings grandma her fresh bread every morning, is not in fact an Islamic sleeper and terrorist," Wendt warned.

Rainer Wendt, Free Republic 52 Comments [4/23/2012 2:43:33 AM]
Fundie Index: 12
WTF?! || meh
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toby

Hey,

I am from Germany and I am totally disgusted by how my country(wo)men freak out about this. They treat the Qu'ran as this dangerous book that turns anyone who reads it into a raging terrorist.

At the same time, in my home town Trier, half a million people are flocking into the city to see the "Holy Tunic", the piece of cloth that Jesus allegedly wore until seconds before he was crucified.
Our local culture centre put up a exhibit which has a name that runs along the lines of "Fetish in art, religion and consume culture". The local churches put pressure on the companies funding the exhibit and made the Sparkasse (a big Germany-based bank) withdraw 15.000€ (almost 20.000 $).

People in this country treat Islam as the single most biggest threat to Germany and its constitution; our Secretary of the Interior, on his first day in office, said "Islam is not a part of Germany", and now refuses to further discuss the topic despite the current events.

I am too disgusted to go on now, but feel free to ask any questions if you want any more insights in this. I will check this thread regularly and try to answer asap.

Toby

4/23/2012 3:00:59 AM



How is this fundie? Most western Islamists terrorists are, in fact, well educated, upper middle class young men, many of who are indeed converts. And depending on which version (translation) of Islam they give it could have a huge effect. Giving a normal translation or a salafist translation could make a huge difference.

Considering Germany is an ultra politically correct country, I presume that the concerns are not unfounded.

4/23/2012 3:03:53 AM

toby

"Considering Germany is an ultra politically correct country, I presume that the concerns are not unfounded."

I am afraid this is only true for most leading politicians, but many Germans are just at the verge of open discrimination most of the time.

4/23/2012 3:06:06 AM



Not fundy at all. Perhaps parts of it are slightly alarmist, but what Wendt is saying is actually true: you can't rule out the 'nice young man from next door' potentially being sleeper terrorist. All he's saying is that the security services should be open to the possibility of anybody being a potential threat, not the standard fundy 'All muslims are terrorists' crap. In fact, any other attitude would be dangerous...

4/23/2012 3:19:38 AM

Leighton Buzzard

One cannot rule out that that nice democracy just across the North Sea won't just suddenly freak out and invade their neighbours, either.

4/23/2012 4:05:53 AM

demodocos

I'm from Germany, too, and I find the comments from some of our politicians regarding this issue far more horrifying than some Muslims distributing free books in our pedestrian areas. To be fair, the Salafists are a bunch of crazy assholes dedicated to some of the worst, inhumane ideas humanity has ever come up with, but giving away copies of the Qur'an is not one of them. It's like being upset about the Westboro Baptist Church offering free Bibles to everyone.

So no, it's not fundie - and it's hardly racist either since the surveillance of this group is justified through different context (the 9/11 hijackers for example went to a Salafist mosque in Hamburg).


The comments on Freerepublic on the other hand...

4/23/2012 4:19:20 AM

Brendan Rizzo

Except for the paranoia, he kind of has a point. Europe spent so much blood, sweat and tears in order to no longer be a fundamentalist hellhole, and I would hate it if Muslim fundamentalists took over the niche which had been filled by Christian fundamentalists for 99.9% of European history.

4/23/2012 4:59:33 AM

Reynardine

And those Gideon Bibles and Books of Mormon you used to find in motels...

4/23/2012 5:04:12 AM

Reynardine

And really watch out for that fresh bread. If it's good enough, people will do anything to get it.

4/23/2012 5:15:03 AM

Doubting Thomas

It's actually a bit comforting to know that the United States isn't the only country with people who are paranoid about Muslims.

4/23/2012 6:06:20 AM

dionysus

Islam is just as much of a bucket of crap as Christianity is, if not more. Nobody wants your bullshit, keep it to yourself.

4/23/2012 6:09:43 AM

D Laurier

I understand that at one time people in europe were talking about how jews were dangerous, and any one of them could be an annointer.
(an annointer was a person who smears plague causing ointment on buildings to spread the plague)
Authoritys were trying to infiltrate jewish organizations to find out who the annointers were.

And of course the jews were working closely with the witches at the time. Everybody knew that.
And the jews and witches coresponded with the king of the mahomettans... who were part of the conspiracy.


Any jew could be an annointer.

4/23/2012 6:13:17 AM

Extraintrovert

This isn't fundie at all. Indeed, it belongs right in RSTDT because SOMEHOW people are equating handing out free books with fostering terrorist cells, which is absurd on the face of it. The very fact that the German police, with an apparent straight face, are perpetuating such rampant and dangerous paranoia is disgusting and stupid.

It's good to be reminded, amongst all the examples from the USA, that European nations have a far longer history of horrifying bigotry, and that it hasn't moved very far at all.

@1395375
That's bullshit. If they were really concerned about "anyone" being a potential threat then they would monitor everyone, not focus on a religious minority. After all, Anders Breivik wasn't Muslim.

@Brendan Rizzo
But is isn't fundamentalists. It's people handing out books. Yes, the books are full of bullshit and so are the people handing them out, but they aren't even forcing anyone to read them and they're hardly worthy of being infiltrated by police. This type of reactionary fear helps religious fundamentalism far more than it hurts it, by spreading fear, distrust and the idea that other religions are inherently inferior to one's own.

4/23/2012 6:51:11 AM



I wonderhow they'd act if it were a Bible in every house. Or a copy of The Magic of Reality.

At the risk of coming close to both a Godwin and whatever the 1984 equivilent is, haven't I heard this shit before?

4/23/2012 7:00:34 AM

tela

Most funny thing about this campaign:

The name "Read!" that you see here is the translated version, the original German name is "Lies!" - and most Germans know enough english to see the second meaning of that word.

http://blasphemieblog2.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/koranlies.jpg

4/23/2012 7:10:30 AM

Agahnim

How is this fundie? They seem to be moderate Muslims, not the fundies that rule countries in the Middle East. They're just trying to disprove the idea that they're all fundies.

Edit: Sorry, I've been sick with a sinus infection for a while and it's been making me lose focus at times. I missed some details but ended up noticing the German guy quoted and not the Muslims are the focus here. I would encourage future FSTDTers to get rid of the negative fundie index because of that.

4/23/2012 7:37:46 AM

Osiris

@Agahnim: The fundies are the Germans, not the Muslims. The Muslims are just doing the exact same thing moderate Christians do, it's harmless and completely voluntary. It's the German conservatives who look at this and think, for no other reason then because the people who are doing it are Muslim, "ZOMG, Secret terrorist recruit ploy!!1"

4/23/2012 8:01:58 AM

Agahnim

@Osiris

I realized that after it was too late to change my vote. I've had a sinus infection for a while and I tend to miss some stuff since being sick makes me lose focus at times. But yeah, the German guy quoted is fundie.

4/23/2012 8:07:39 AM



We made it all the way to 11 comments before 12 Godwin'd. I'm rather amazed the first post didn't Godwin right away.

4/23/2012 8:33:44 AM

Lucilius

I knew those Gideons were bent on world domination, one motel room at a time.

And while the Muslim population in Europe is growing fast compared to mainline Christian groups, outside of the Balkans (which have had large Muslim populations for centuries), the comparative numbers are still very small. Hysteria over a "Muslim takeover" is no more realistic there than in the U.S.

4/23/2012 8:45:19 AM

JohnTheAtheist

I think that Germany should round up all suspected Muslims and send the to a developed system of camps...oh wait...scratch that.

4/23/2012 8:52:16 AM

Anon

Perfect, free door stoppers, targets for shotgun practice and free kindling! WOOT!

4/23/2012 9:22:14 AM

Philbert McAdamia

"Islamic sleeper" , Hmmm. Last night I was an atheist sleeper -- for a good 8 hours, too.


@Reynardine
And really watch out for that fresh bread. If it's good enough, people will do anything to get it.

Hell, yes, they lose their damn heads over the stuff.

4/23/2012 9:38:04 AM

Mister Spak

Stopped clock here in freeperland.

4/23/2012 10:06:58 AM

tranz2deep

It's not Fundy to US, but the Freeps are freaking out as it's horror-shock to THEM.

This post is a heads-up to the deluge of Fundie, bigoted stupidity that is absolutely sure to be spawned by the post in short order.

4/23/2012 12:29:32 PM
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