Sister Margaret McBride, a Catholic nun and a long time administrator at St. Joseph's Hospital and Medical Center in Phoenix, has been excommunicated by her local Phoenix bishop, Thomas J Olmsted, after she agreed with a hospital ethics committee that an 11-week-old fetus had to be aborted in order to save the life of a mother.
Bishop Thomas J. Olmsted stated the Sister of Mercy was "automatically excommunicated" because of the action. She has also been demoted in her job.
The patient concerned had a rare and often fatal condition in which the pregnancy can cause the death of the mother.
35 comments
This is the sort of nonsense that is causing Christianity to lose adherents in droves.
Fundies, this is why you are irrelevant.
Christianity, the religion of Morality and Love.
I think we need not say any more. Religion indicts itself through its own actions.
@Berny
Old news.
Well, old or not, it would be interesting to see how Ms. McBride is doing these days, having been freed from the bondage of her vows.
I bet she's doing better than before.
""The Catholic Church will continue to defend life and proclaim the evil of abortion without compromise, and must act to correct even her own members if they fail in this duty," the bishop said."
^
^
^
So, by "defending life" we should let two people die instead of one.
Because we fear hell so much we'd rather indirectly cause two death instead of directly cause one.
As a (lapsed) cradle Catholic brought up in the 60's, I distincly remember being taught that, under Church teaching, when the mother's life was in danger if the pregnancy continued, then abortion was acceptable to save the mother's life.
The Vatican should have kicked this Bishop's arse so hard he'd still be in orbit. Is this story for real or what?
What do you get by not aborting the fetus? Two lost lives. An 11 week old fetus is far too young to survive without the mother. If the life of the mother is at risk then the life of that fetus if forfeit no matter what. At least with abortion you could actually save a life!
This is what happens when unthinking dogma replaces true morality.
You'd have to be seriously fucked in the head to think that God wouldn't want a fetus aborted if not aborting it would kill it and mother alike.
But then, people who are fucked in the head are why this site exists.
With all the bullshit coming from Arizona lately, this woman is very brave for doing this. I'd give her a medal if I could. The Bishop, and all the other Arizonans against women's rights can screw themselves.
She did the right thing. It's a travesty of professional judgement that she was demoted in her job (I hope she was either reinstated or compensated), but it's GOOD that she was excommunicated. One less nun in the World, and hopefully now a stronger, wiser, more independent woman who no longer depends on stupid bishops or a stupid religious hierarchy.
Life begins at conception and ends at birth.
Apatheist and thirddrop:
You are both wrong. In catholic theology not doing an abortion is more important than the womans life. She must die if there is no way to save her without an abortion.
If you ask a catholic fundie what to do in this situation the answer is "the doctor must do his best to save both patients" followed by "there was a woman with cancer who refused chemotherapy because it would harm the baby. The baby was born healthy and the mother heroically died to give her child life" but they never actually answer the question in spite of many repetitions. They know what they will look like if they answer honestly so they will always evade and doubletalk.
This is why I absolutely hate the Catholic church and the "pro-life" crowd. Absolutely no abortions any time, anywhere, can ever be allowed to happen under any circumstances. If the mother dies because of pregnancy complications, then it's God's will.
(But it was OK for Rick Santorum's wife because she had other kids at home who would have been without a mother had she died.)
I would not generally be in favour of abortion, especially as a means of family control. There are products that can achieve this without terminating incipient life.
HOWEVER
Where it comes down to the danger of a foetus killing its mother, that is an entirely different matter. The life of the mother is at least as sacred in absolute terms as that incipient life. Her life is of more immediate importance to her husband and any children they may have; to her parents and siblings too.
It is a tragic choice to have to make, but I hold that morally the woman's right to life in this situation must take priority. To fail to acknowledge this is to put one's mitre, with one's head deep into the sand of medieval bullshit.
Does the former Catholic nun have a case for loss of earnings due to veing reduced in earnings status on religious grounds?
Mister Spak,
Not sure where you are getting your info but as a licensed Catechist I can tell you that you are wrong.
If the life of the mother necessistates an abortion, especially prior to viability, there is no sin. Abortion is permissible.
I'm a medical assistant. Admittedly, however, I've yet to have a patient with this mother's condition, so I may not be completely accurate in the following comments.
To save the life of the mother? It's terrible, and traumatic for the patient, but it happens in real life. Meaning the best way to go about this is to explain things to the patient and their potential partner, and then let them make the decision about what they want to do, instead of forcing religious dogma into an already tragic and traumatic event.
According to the article, the patient had pulmonary hypertension (Wikipedia link), which "interferes with the ability of the heart and lungs to function and is often made fatal by pregnancy." Meaning the Sister was sure they would have both died anyway had this not been done. This Sister is awesome. Any other doctor would be considered "just doing their job" for doing this.
Effing morons.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excommunication_of_Margaret_McBride
According to Wikipedia, she's no longer excommunicated. The hospital itself wouldn't budge, and refused to promise to never perform another abortion.
In December 2010, Olmsted announced that the Roman Catholic Diocese of Phoenix was severing its affiliation with the hospital, after months of discussion had failed to obtain from the hospital management a promise not to perform abortions in the future. "If we are presented with a situation in which a pregnancy threatens a woman's life, our first priority is to save both patients. If that is not possible, we will always save the life we can save, and that is what we did in this case," said hospital president Linda Hunt. "Morally, ethically, and legally, we simply cannot stand by and let someone die whose life we might be able to save."
@Willaien:
So, the hospital basically refused to break the law or violate basic human ethics to appease some jerk Bishop.
Good for them. I hope Ms. McBride is doing well.
Confused?
So were we! You can find all of this, and more, on Fundies Say the Darndest Things!
To post a comment, you'll need to Sign in or Register . Making an account also allows you to claim credit for submitting quotes, and to vote on quotes and comments. You don't even need to give us your email address.