A Friend

For those who don't understand why some try to fight the exponential increase in conscience, it is because it shows there is a Creator who created. The exponential progression in conscience disallows an eternity of the past of cause and effects, because you would not still be sinning by now having been derived from the past. Therefore, the only possibility is the uncreated created. This proves the Creator exists and He is uncreated. Know that He is God of the Bible: the Trinity of God the Father, God the Son and God the Spirit, for none can compare to Christ.

[size=10]All of David B.'s charts are wrong including his latest one, and he can't find anything in what I said that would cause him to draw his charts. Therefore what he claims is false. His fuzzy math is wrong which the bare naked eye can see, because obviously, you can't have negative child sacrifices or negative conscience, so he is sinning bearing false witness. You don't need to know those math formulas to be saved, for then only people who knew calculus could be born-again. There is no other way to depict the exponential progression of conscience on a chart. The original chart given, again, as a result of our findings remains the correct one:



(This chart was created and donated by an atheist who at least understood the principle, so David B. is contradicting his atheist cohorts-they just can't seem to agree on much. Sometimes they say the universe happened all by itself; other times they say it always existed. According to pure logic, a non-believer (atheist) writes "that this calculation [Step 1] tells us that we are moving from more to less sin and concludes that since we have not reached the state of ultimate sinlessness then it must be the case that there was not an eternity of past causes and effects. The argument is deductively valid" - Arturo from think the secular playground.)

Replace "global conscience" with child sacrifices per capita with the lower number higher up on the chart. If you prefer, you can place the horizontal axis on the top side of the chart so that the vertical axis points downward. This causes the curve to steepen downward exponentially (and, also never goes negative) with the lower number lower down on the chart which produces the same effect of an exponential decrease in child sacrifices.

Notice how he draws his chart(s) wrong every time even after it was already explained to him his error. That's called belligerency or obstinacy and shutting his own mind down.

None of his charts fit. He uses them to misrepresent. That is the tactic of the evil spirit. Child sacrifices can't go negative and do not abruptly hit zero, so charts C (which is also the latest chart) & D are useless. With time along the horizontal axis, A & C (the latest chart) show a creation, which does not help his beliefs.

With time continuing on the horizontal axis, his charts B & D fail because they indicate an ever increasing speed into the past to a slower rate to the present. That would not be an exponential increase in conscience of getting better faster. I am glad that by the grace of God as we move forward there is an exponential improvement in conscience, not decreasing improvement.

Hence, there is only one chart that works. The one I gave originally. It is good advice for David B. to accept the truth, for the truth shall set him free.

This is God's design. Embrace it and receive Jesus as your uncreated Creator, Lord and Savior! For the consequences of rejecting God's grace of eternal forgiveness is a never ending punishment of hellfire-an eternal separation from God and those He chose before the foundations of the world.

The unsaved soul tries to rationalize his existence apart from God in all kinds of mental gymnastics. Such pompous attitude does not seem to get embarrased by what silly things it comes up with to reject the love of Christ. He'll have no excuses at Great White Throne. He is without excuse now! How you respond to Jesus today determines how you will live out in eternity.[/size]

A Friend

For those who don't understand why some try to fight the exponential increase in conscience, it is because it shows there is a Creator who created. The exponential progression in conscience disallows an eternity of the past of cause and effects, because you would not still be sinning by now having been derived from the past. Therefore, the only possibility is the uncreated created. This proves the Creator exists and He is uncreated. Know that He is God of the Bible: the Trinity of God the Father, God the Son and God the Spirit, for none can compare to Christ.

[size=10]All of David B.'s charts are wrong including his latest one, and he can't find anything in what I said that would cause him to draw his charts. Therefore what he claims is false. His fuzzy math is wrong which the bare naked eye can see, because obviously, you can't have negative child sacrifices or negative conscience, so he is sinning bearing false witness. You don't need to know those math formulas to be saved, for then only people who knew calculus could be born-again. There is no other way to depict the exponential progression of conscience on a chart. The original chart given, again, as a result of our findings remains the correct one:



(This chart was created and donated by an atheist who at least understood the principle, so David B. is contradicting his atheist cohorts-they just can't seem to agree on much. Sometimes they say the universe happened all by itself; other times they say it always existed. According to pure logic, a non-believer (atheist) writes "that this calculation [Step 1] tells us that we are moving from more to less sin and concludes that since we have not reached the state of ultimate sinlessness then it must be the case that there was not an eternity of past causes and effects. The argument is deductively valid" - Arturo from think the secular playground.)

Replace "global conscience" with child sacrifices per capita with the lower number higher up on the chart. If you prefer, you can place the horizontal axis on the top side of the chart so that the vertical axis points downward. This causes the curve to steepen downward exponentially (and, also never goes negative) with the lower number lower down on the chart which produces the same effect of an exponential decrease in child sacrifices.

Notice how he draws his chart(s) wrong every time even after it was already explained to him his error. That's called belligerency or obstinacy and shutting his own mind down.

None of his charts fit (see charts A,B,C,D here. Chart C is also the big chart on page 16). He uses them to misrepresent. That is the tactic of the evil spirit. Child sacrifices can't go negative and do not abruptly hit zero, so charts C (which is also the latest chart) & D are useless. With time along the horizontal axis, A & C (the latest chart) show a creation, which does not help his beliefs.

With time continuing on the horizontal axis, his charts B & D fail because they indicate an ever increasing speed into the past to a slower rate to the present. That would not be an exponential increase in conscience of getting better faster. I am glad that by the grace of God as we move forward there is an exponential improvement in conscience, not decreasing improvement.

Hence, there is only one chart that works. The one I gave originally. It is good advice for David B. to accept the truth, for the truth shall set him free.

This is God's design. Embrace it and receive Jesus as your uncreated Creator, Lord and Savior! For the consequences of rejecting God's grace of eternal forgiveness is a never ending punishment of hellfire-an eternal separation from God and those He chose before the foundations of the world.

The unsaved soul tries to rationalize his existence apart from God in all kinds of mental gymnastics. Such pompous attitude does not seem to get embarrased by what silly things it comes up with to reject the love of Christ. He'll have no excuses at Great White Throne. He is without excuse now! How you respond to Jesus today determines how you will live out in eternity.[/size]

A Friend

[size=10]If you don't understand why some try to fight the exponential increase in conscience, it is because it shows there is a Creator who created. The exponential progression in conscience disallows an eternity of the past of cause and effects, because you would not still be sinning by now having been derived from the past. Therefore, the only possibility is the uncreated created. This proves the Creator exists and He is uncreated. Know that He is God of the Bible: the Trinity of God the Father, God the Son and God the Spirit, for none can compare to Christ.

All of David B.'s charts are wrong including his latest one, and he can't find anything in what I said that would cause him to draw his charts. Therefore what he claims is false. His fuzzy math is wrong which the bare naked eye can see, because obviously, you can't have negative child sacrifices or negative conscience, so he is sinning bearing false witness. You don't need to know those math formulas to be saved, for then only people who knew calculus could be born-again. There is no other way to depict the exponential progression of conscience on a chart. The original chart given, again, as a result of our findings remains the correct one:



(This chart was created and donated by an atheist who at least understood the principle, so David B. is contradicting his atheist cohorts-they just can't seem to agree on much. Sometimes they say the universe happened all by itself; other times they say it always existed. According to pure logic, a non-believer (atheist) writes "that this calculation [Step 1] tells us that we are moving from more to less sin and concludes that since we have not reached the state of ultimate sinlessness then it must be the case that there was not an eternity of past causes and effects. The argument is deductively valid" - Arturo from think the secular playground.)

Replace "global conscience" with child sacrifices per capita with the lower number higher up on the chart. If you prefer, you can place the horizontal axis on the top side of the chart so that the vertical axis points downward. This causes the curve to steepen downward exponentially (and, also never goes negative) with the lower number lower down on the chart which produces the same effect of an exponential decrease in child sacrifices.

Notice how he draws his chart(s) wrong every time even after it was already explained to him his error. That's called belligerency or obstinacy and shutting his own mind down.

None of his charts fit (see charts A,B,C,D here). Chart C is also the big chart on page 16). He uses them to misrepresent. That is the tactic of the evil spirit. Child sacrifices can't go negative and do not abruptly hit zero, so charts C (which is also the latest chart) & D are useless. With time along the horizontal axis, A & C (the latest chart) show a creation, which does not help his beliefs.

With time continuing on the horizontal axis, his charts B & D fail because they indicate an ever increasing speed into the past to a slower rate to the present. That would not be an exponential increase in conscience of getting better faster. I am glad that by the grace of God as we move forward there is an exponential improvement in conscience, not decreasing improvement.

Hence, there is only one chart that works. The one I gave originally. It is good advice for David B. to accept the truth, for the truth shall set him free.

This is God's design. Embrace it and receive Jesus as your uncreated Creator, Lord and Savior! For the consequences of rejecting God's grace of eternal forgiveness is a never ending punishment of hellfire-an eternal separation from God and those He chose before the foundations of the world.

The unsaved soul tries to rationalize his existence apart from God in all kinds of mental gymnastics. Such pompous attitude does not seem to get embarrased by what silly things it comes up with to reject the love of Christ. He'll have no excuses at Great White Throne. He is without excuse now! How you respond to Jesus today determines how you will live out in eternity.[/size]

Anonymous

[size=104]STOP![/size]
[size=104]STOP![/size]
[size=104]STOP![/size]

Look, folks, let's just stop replying to Troy. Logic is useless against his delusions. If we let him get in the last word, he'll finally just leave us alone.

A Friend

[size=14]Notice how Anonymous is delusional, shutting his mind down to the fact that he can't find anything wrong with the proof for God yet still calls Jesus a liar. Such belligerent people don't care about the truth and logic.

He is a bad man who is going to hell, obviously. You don't have to follow in his footsteps. You do have a choice.

The reason he tries for the last word is because the proof for God is affecting him as you would expect.

You can avoid the truth now but then go to hell later. Your choice.[/size]

A Friend

Salvation is available to everyone who wants it.

A Friend

If you don't want it, you won't get it.

A Friend

You won't find it if you don't search it out with all your heart and soul.

A Friend

If you prefer to remain unforgiven, so be it.

A Friend

Nobody is forcing you to accept Christ.

A Friend

Jesus said He is God and said to turn the other cheek. The teaching to turn the other cheek comes for God's Word, so it seems contradictory to say accept the teaching chosen from the Bible but reject the source.

Isn't it absurd to find no fault with the proof for God yet still reject it? In being therefore wrong but not admitting it is not very big. It is a delusion the insanity to reject a truth when it is so clearly given.

All one can do is troll instead of repenting to that truth, yet, there is opportunity for you to be saved, for God is a gracious God full of mercy and patience. This is why my brothers and sisters in Christ are fishers of men and women, not just atheists, but anyone who is unsaved, for we know the joy of the Holy Spirit that indwells us and wish for you to have the same.

But God won't wait forever. You get this one life to decide to accept what Jesus did for you on the cross. After that, there is no further opportunity to be saved to be forgiven for all your sins and receive eternal life. You can say the choice in this life to remain unsaved is a choice to remain in hell forever.

If all you want to do is shut your mind down and to have me go away, you would have not responded to this thread in which many hours had passed and the thread was several pages back, yet you pulled back to the front. What do you think is going on in your psyche that you would do that?

You ban them because you don't have any idea of how get rid of them without looking a deranged individual. However, you expect us to stand 632 of your comments where you only spout nonsense that nobody except you agree with and you expect us to put up with you.

Banning

Whe you ban someome make sure you only do so for valid reason, otherwise you are just banning them to censor.

An Enemy (of Troy, at least)

The whole basis of your '4 Step Proof' is that 'Nothing in the universe is without a cause'. Specifically, that nothing in nature happens by itself, or to use the axiom 'There is NO effect without a CAUSE'. And if anyone can prove otherwise, you'll pay them $10,000? Okay:

Radioactive decay. An effect without a cause. Thus your whole 'proof' falls apart. Thus no 'Jesus', and therefore no 'God'.

QED.

That'll be $10,000 please.

A Help for An Enemy

There is no proof radioactive decay has no cause. How silly to think radioactive decay happens by magic. When an apple rots into nothing, it doesn't happen without a cause.

The 4 Step Proof does not only prove the universe can't cause itself. It also shows that there cannot be an eternity of the past of cause effects. Therefore, God created because He is uncreated.

Hell is not only for those who (1) reject the uncreated Creator, but also (2) those who do not accept Jesus is the uncreated Creator and (3) do not receive what He did for you on the cross.

An Enemy (of Troy, at least)

But a 'cause' is something that has a practical purpose. What is the purpose of radioactive decay? Specifically, what practical purpose does it serve? As far as I can tell, none. You're just mindlessly shutting your mind down to the fact that radioactive decay is an effect without a cause. Because then your house of cards called 'Faith' falls apart. But then 'Faith' is an effect without a cause, because it's based on words. Just words. If the Bible was FACT, then I could walk into my wardrobe & emerge out the other side into another world and meet a talking lion (in before 'Get in the Car' etc), because words by CS Lewis says so. Just as if I went 88 MPH in a DeLorean, I'd travel back in time, because three films says so.

But of course these things wouldn't happen, because these are mere works of fiction, with no basis in FACT. The 'FACTS' you claim in your 'beliefs' are themselves based on mere WORDS. With no actual physical EVIDENCE. The only evidence that I (and many, indeed ALL 'nonbelievers' as you'd call them, Troy) would need to accept is for your 'God of the Bible' to actually SHOW himself (and in before your protestations of 'Even if he DID appear, you wouldn't accept Him!', I'm more than willing to test that experiment), in physical form, that can be SEEN, HEARD and TOUCHED, so we can SEE that he exists. Even if he's the size of Galactus, and is the stereotypical image (old guy in white robes & beard), that'll be fine. That's all it'll take for we Atheists to admit we were wrong, and you were right all along, and to accept the existence of such a being. That's ALL it'll take.


...what's that? If God actually PROVES he exists in this way, that'll destroy your religion, because PROOF denies FAITH?! Well, that little paradox is YOUR problem, and until you can commit spiritual suicide, (and admit that the likes of Richard Dawkins was RIGHT all along, and you're WRONG) STFU, GTFO & quit bothering us. Indeed, why not speed up that 'Rapture' you lot always bang on about, and all drink that Kool Aid (a la Jim Jones)?! At least we'll live in a better & SUPERIOR Atheist world.