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Quote# 89334

The first belief we have in American government, in American society is that there’s a divine Creator, that’s not a personal belief, that’s an official government belief, that’s in our founding document. The first thing we say is there’s a Creator, the second thing we say is we believe the Creator gave us a certain set of rights, that are God-given inalienable rights, they exist to every person on the globe just because they were born, actually just because they were conceived quite frankly. Founding Fathers recognized abortion as a crime way back in the beginning, that’s why in the Seventh Amendment of the Constitution, part of the common law, you’re not allowed to do abortions because God gives life, not humans, humans can’t take life that God gives so it’s real simple stuff.

The seventh amendment actually says "In Suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury shall be otherwise re–examined in any Court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law."

David Barton, Right Wing Watch 33 Comments [9/4/2012 3:01:03 AM]
Fundie Index: 49
Submitted By: Zagen30
WTF?! || meh
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Leander

I am no expert on american law but what the heck has the quote even to do with abortion?
Also, if humans can't take life that god gives than you should be against the death penalty, hypocrite.

9/4/2012 3:31:32 AM

Prager

"God gives life, not humans, humans can’t take life that God gives so it’s real simple stuff"

Say goodbye to capital punishment!!

9/4/2012 3:33:30 AM

Filin De Blanc

The guy claims to be a historian and he can't even get the Seventh Amendment right. Why should we pay any attention to anything you say?

9/4/2012 3:36:03 AM

Veras_the_Brujah

@Leander

I think he is saying that the fetus has the right to trial by a jury of its peers before it can be aborted (executed, in his mind).

I wonder if the jury has to be made up of other fetuses?

9/4/2012 4:22:45 AM

Percy Q. Shunn

Why the fuck did god shoot up that movie theater in Colorado?

9/4/2012 4:30:48 AM



The first thing we say is there’s a Creator, the second thing we say is we believe the Creator gave us a certain set of rights, that are God-given inalienable rights...

That's in the Declaration of Independence which is not, repeat not, our basis for government. The US Constitution is.

A "historian" such as David Barton should know and understand the difference.

9/4/2012 4:58:06 AM

MrsYoungie

David Barton? Isn't he the one whose book on Jefferson was found to be so non-factual (i.e. full of lies) that it was pulled by the publisher?

9/4/2012 5:25:34 AM

Doubting Thomas

Um, excuse me, where does it say "God" or "Jesus" anywhere in the Constitution? And how exactly do you get "no abortion" out of an amendment that talks about trial by jury?

9/4/2012 5:50:50 AM

Mister Spak

"The first belief we have in American government, in American society is that congress shal make no law regarding religion.

9/4/2012 6:07:10 AM

Jeff Weskamp

@MrsYoungie:

Yes, he is.

9/4/2012 6:14:58 AM

mad the swine

First: The Constitution is not 'common law'. Common law is law and interpretations of law set by judicial precedent.

Second: Barton's arguing that the Seventh Amendment prohibits killing anyone without due process of law, including unborn children. He neglects to note that the weight of judicial precedent ("common law") sets personhood to begin at birth, not conception, and that fetuses lack Constitutional rights. Among other reasons why that's a silly claim.

Third:

David Barton here: "God gives life, not humans, humans can’t take life that God gives so it’s real simple stuff."

I wonder how Barton feels about the death penalty?

9/4/2012 6:55:57 AM

dionysus

God gives life, not humans, humans can’t take life that God gives so it’s real simple stuff

Then how do you explain all of those verses where God commands us to kill people for picking up sticks or being gay or for having the gall to live in the wrong spot of land? Was that God's idea of a practical joke (God: "LOL! They either sin by killing or sin by disobeying me. Either way they're going to hell. Can't wait to see the looks on their faces!)?

9/4/2012 7:05:02 AM

John_in_Oz

You know what the Founding Fathers would say if they could see America today?
"Holy Fuck, airplanes!"

9/4/2012 7:07:44 AM

Cousin Id

Some future Barton revelations about the U.S. Constitution:

The fourth amendment prohibits premarital sex.
Article II, Section 1 mandates witch-burning.
The preamble is clearly orthodox Trinitarian in its theology.
The twelfth amendment makes Jesus an honorary Congressman.

9/4/2012 7:53:36 AM

farpadokly

Just cos it says it in the Declaration of Independence doesn't make it an "official government belief". The Declaration isn't a holy text that you have to believe every word of, or you can't be an American.

9/4/2012 8:12:31 AM



I think he maaay just have gotten the Constitution and the commandments screwed up....

9/4/2012 8:50:43 AM

Fundies Make Me Sick

That's the Declaration of Independence. The Constitution says nothing about a creator. What matters is the Constitution, not the Declaration because the latter has no legal authority.

9/4/2012 8:56:22 AM

J. James

David Barton is a "historian" on the same sense that Joseph Goebbels was an investigative reporter.

9/4/2012 9:35:04 AM

toth

Does a fetus' life exceed a value of $20?

9/4/2012 9:58:54 AM

Kisare

How do you misinterpret the Constitution THAT badly? Our primary education system must be worse than I thought!

9/4/2012 10:31:16 AM

Meeeh

Only in the United Fundie States is this even an issue...

9/4/2012 11:08:47 AM

Swede

Should I have held a funeral after my miscarriage? Perhaps an autopsy to determine why the embryo started de-evolving, regressing, in the sixth week?

I very much agree with you there, Dave; humans ought not to take life. Life, of course, being someone that is born and viable. War, murder and the death penalty are heinous crimes against humanity. Good to know we have you on our side in the fight against the death penalty, Mr Barton, very good!

9/4/2012 11:23:44 AM

Sasha

@Kisare, he's not misinterpreting the Constitution. He's lying.

9/4/2012 11:29:29 AM

nazani14

The "endowed by our creator with .." is a metaphorical flourish meant to shame King George, a purported representative of Christ as the head of the Anglican church. It is neither an official policy nor a law. The founders were quite explicit about there not being any "official government belief."
You fail civics forever.

9/4/2012 12:33:43 PM

breakerslion

God gives life, not humans, humans can’t take life that God gives so it’s real simple stuff."

Been to any war memorials lately?

9/4/2012 1:06:42 PM
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