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Quote# 89925

[Two HIV+ men rape a 17-year old boy.]

Well, all you homo-lovers out there, here's a little more blood on your hands. You saw the study data the same as we did that showed homosexuals to be thirty times (30!) more likely to molest children than straights are, that they are substantially more likely to have STDs, but you were so very worried about appearing intolerant.

Well, you have helped rape this boy as surely as they have.

Fading Light, Stormfront 55 Comments [10/5/2012 7:04:34 AM]
Fundie Index: 93
Submitted By: Rabbit of Caerbannog
WTF?! || meh
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Old Viking

The study I saw says Stormfront contributors are 30 times more likely to make up statistics than normal people are.

10/5/2012 1:28:50 PM

tracer

One swallow doth not a summer make.

10/5/2012 2:10:25 PM

J. James

Can we step down the victim-blaming here? Age makes no difference when it comes to forcible rape. We don't have all the details, so let's just assume that rape is rape and stop putting some of the responsibility on the 17-year-old.

This has been a public service announcement.

10/5/2012 2:18:11 PM

dp

@#1455323

check you out, blaming rape victims and catching spelling errors. though i think you got a little over zealous with the "on foot" vs "by foot" thing. going somewhere by foot means that you were traveling via walking, just like going somewhere by car means that you were traveling via car.

i wonder if i can submit this.

10/5/2012 2:26:35 PM

shykid

No, I didn't see this "study" data, because it doesn't exist. You and the perpetrators are the only people here with blood on their hands: the perpetrators for obvious reasons, and you for being sick and vulturous enough to try to smear an entire class of people using a heinous but isolated act that violated and traumatized another human being in the worst possible way. You a sick monster.

If a couple of straight guys did something like this to a girl, the last thing you would hear me say is something like, "Well, all you hetero-lovers out there, here's a little more blood on your hands." (Don't even try to say there's not a small minority of fucked-up straight people who do shit like this too—and, hell, since rape is about power rather than sexual gratification, the guys who did this particular act could have been straight for all you know.)

@Xotan: Blaming the victim (and trying to "correct" someone's grammatically acceptable English when your own command of the language screams "I'm obviously not a native speaker"). Classy. I actually respected and kind of admired you until I read this bullshit.

10/5/2012 2:54:51 PM

JSS

Wait wait wait. A frequenter of Stormfront: a site that promotes racist, anti-semetic, homophobic, sexist and overall fascist views in their most extreme form, the same form seen with Hitler, Mussolini, Franco, Pavelic (I could go on) leaving death tolls in the millions (not to mention all the serial killer white supremacists), is asking the entire gay rights movement to repent because two gay persons happened to be psychopaths?

Oh noes! Consciences of gay people and supporters all over the world tortured without mercy! All will quake and tremble as their own hardened hearts are convicted by the dehumanizing savagery of Neo-Nazi "morality"!

10/5/2012 3:09:52 PM

Doubting Thomas

And how many pedophiles are straight again?

10/5/2012 4:30:51 PM

Nemo Tatzikian

Stormfront seems to be diversifying it's bigotry portfolio as of late. It used to be just about Jews and Blacks, but now it's extended to all sorts of minority groups.

10/5/2012 8:02:43 PM



I want a citation for the statistics.

You can be tolerant of anyone, without excusing criminal conduct. I tolerated Ted Haggard for example , and catholic preists in spite of the actions of many of them.

Every child abuser I have seen as been straight.


10/5/2012 9:58:00 PM

Indicible

[sarcasm]
Are we sure the boy was not consenting? After all, the human body has ways to defend itself against rape. In any case, he is in no risk of contracting HIV, if it is indeed a legal rape.
[/sarcasm]

Rapists are asswipes, no matter their sexual orientation, that much is true.
Doesn't justify lying, just to vilify the rest of the homosexuals.

10/5/2012 10:04:58 PM



"1987, Dr. Stephen Rubin of Whitman College" this is the report he bases his statistics on.

136 offenders with kids of the opposite sex
63 offends with same sex kids.

63/199 = 30% roughly


10/5/2012 10:20:26 PM

Wehpudicabok

First of all, my sympathies are with the poor boy whose life was ruined by these two despicable men. That being said...

Always funny how many people make offhand references to "studies", yet how few of them actually have the studies to back them up.

Here's mine. Psychology department of the University of California, Davis.

"Groth and Birnbaum (1978) studied 175 adult males who were convicted in Massachusetts of sexual assault against a child. None of the men had an exclusively homosexual adult sexual orientation." (emphasis added)

"Dr. Carole Jenny and her colleagues reviewed 352 medical charts, representing all of the sexually abused children seen in the emergency room or child abuse clinic of a Denver children's hospital during a one-year period ... The molester was a gay or lesbian adult in fewer than 1% [of cases] in which an adult molester could be identified – only 2 of the 269 cases (Jenny et al., 1994)."

That took about two minutes of research. Overcoming stupidity, however, can take a lifetime.

@anonymous poster immediately above me:

I hope you understand what the OP apparently doesn't: "30% of cases are homosexual in nature" does not mean "gays are 30 times more likely than straights to molest." After all, by the same study, 70% of cases are heterosexual. Therefore straights are 70 times more likely to molest than gays?!? Of course not.

Edit: JOHN IN OZ STOP BEING FASTER THAN ME WITH YOUR GOOGLING!!! :(

Just kidding ;)

10/6/2012 12:45:12 AM

breakerslion

I happen to know that there are criminals living in Brooklyn. Therefore, living in Brooklyn makes you a criminal.

Allowing people to live in Brooklyn makes you responsible for their crimes.

SEE WHAT I DID THERE, YOU FUCKING MORON?

10/6/2012 6:58:39 AM



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10/6/2012 8:50:53 AM



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10/6/2012 8:51:25 AM

Firewing

Yet when you Christians go around raping children we're supposed to excuse every single instance, no matter how frequently it happens? Such hypocrisy can only be expected from Stormfront.

10/6/2012 10:19:24 AM

Anon-e-moose

And in some cultures, the men 'believe' that AIDS can be cured by having sex with a young virgin girl.

Your point, Farting Shite?

10/6/2012 11:00:30 AM

Xotan

@ J. James & shykid

Blaming the victim? My intention was to be sympathetic to him but critical of his lack of a sense of danger.

It is a fact that the young man drank so much that he passed out. There is no indication that his drinking was not voluntary. It is undeniable that this led to the opportunity for the alleged rape by the barmen. (Alleged for legal reasons. Have they been condemned in a court yet?) The young man of his own volition acted irresponsibly and put himself into of danger of all kinds of things - he could have been robbed or even murdered. As it happens it was rape. Bad, but at least he is still alive.

Should it have happened? Of course not. He was taken advantage of. Do I approve of what happened. Certainly not. I made all of this clear.

But there remains the question of responsibility. This young man drank irresponsibly and came to grief as a result. He rendered himself unconscious and handed the opportunity to the perpetrators on a plate. This is also fact.

I sympathise with him, and am thankful he did not contract HIV, but his self-induced unconsciousness meant he was not in comtrol of things. Had he remained even reasonably sober he would likely not have got into this terrible situation.

It is hardly blaming the victim to state the facts we have been given.

He has learned a tough lesson that will likely haunt his life.

@ shykid - again

as it happens I grew up bilingually. English was one of the languages. I now have lived for many years in a place where I seldom, if ever, use it. Language changes over time, so if it pleases you, I'll happily concede your point on this score. My English is undoubtedly dated.


10/6/2012 11:10:32 AM

Canadia

@Xotan

'She was putting herself at risk, going out dressed provacatively. I don't think she deserved to be raped, but if she hadn't willingly engaged in such activity it might have been avoided.'

Just because you engage in an activity (ANY activity) that could lead to being raped does not mean you are responsible for being victimized.

10/6/2012 2:52:42 PM

Mad_Jester

Look at his username- "Fading Light". By definition, he's dim and getting dimmer.

10/6/2012 3:25:48 PM

anon

~if it was a real rape, he wouldn't get aids. The system has ways to shut that whole thing down.~

10/6/2012 3:40:40 PM

Xotan

@ Canadia

"She was putting herself at risk, going out dressed provacatively. I don't think she deserved to be raped, but if she hadn't willingly engaged in such activity it might have been avoided."

But this is not a parallel. Your hypothetical woman has not drunk herself unconscious. She could be carying mace or a whistle in her bag.

Let us be clear, never have I said that anyone deserved to be raped. On the contrary. I have condemned rapists. So please do not put words into my mouth.

Is it not a fact that if this youth had been sober (let's say even drinking moderately) he would have been able to defend himself, or make his escape?

I would maintain your hyothetical woman's right to dress as she pleases and not be unmolested. That, though, presumes a world where everyone is decent and there is universal respect - where sex molesters and rapists do not operate. Likewise, I maintain the same right for this young man to become unconscious with alcohol, if he wishes, even though he may be breaking the law. His choice. It would be foolish, however, to miss the fact there there are those who will take advantage, sexually or otherwise, if they get the opportunity.

In essence the argument is being made that it is OK not to behave responsibly; this is ignoring the often harsh realities of this world. It presumes there should be no expectation of consequences. There is, however, a wide difference between having a right to do something and the wisdom of doing so. This is the kernel of the matter.

Canadia, let me put the case: you are a mother or father old enough have a son of 17 who is going out and drinking. Would you not worry for his safety? Would you not expect him to act responsibly lest something similar (or worse) happen to him?


10/6/2012 4:49:25 PM

J. James

@Xotan

You REALLY need to draw a line between "Preventable tragedy" and "The victim bears responsibility for his rape."

There is NEVER any blame for someone who was forced to do something against their will. Period. There is no such thing. You could be a self-medicated fully-naked supermodel that is passed out in the seediest, most lawless alley in Mogadishu, Somalia and you STILL bear zero responsibility for being raped against your will. Stupid, yes. Culpable, no.

It works the other way, too: if someone is, say, asleep in their own home, and they are attacked in a break in, they are not "less" responsible for the attack because they did everything "right." Let's add another detail to the metaphor: that victim forgot to lock up their home properly. Are they suddenly "more responsible" for the rape? No.

And that's what I'm getting at here: there is no splitting hairs when it comes to victimhood. Is little Anne Frank more responsible for being extinguished in the concentration camps because she didn't have the forethought to learn how to use a machine gun and kill her pursuers? No. Is a woman more responsible for being raped because she didn't carry Mace in her purse? NO.

There is no way I can drill this into your head enough: THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS VICTIM RESPONSIBILITY FOR A RAPE.

By the way, I don't know if you have ever heard this before, but alcohol is known to impair judgment. Shocker, I know! Still doesn't make him any more or less responsible, though!

P.S.- I noticed you're looking at this entirely backwards. You are clearly falling for hindsight bias- "of course this random string of events will inevitably lead to rape! After all, it happened, didn't it? Therefore everyone involved should have seen it coming!"

10/6/2012 8:16:08 PM

Mister Spak

Well all you America haters out there, this is what you've been doing these past few decades.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corrective_rape

10/8/2012 7:23:48 AM

Ludd

"You saw the study data the same as we did that showed homosexuals to be thirty times (30!) more likely to molest children than straights are"

Well I mean c'mon guys. I'm sure we can trust a 'fact' from some random bonehead posting on Stormfront's website. It's not like they are ever full of shit or delusional.

10/8/2012 10:52:02 AM
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