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Quote# 90870

I think it is important to note that there is absolutely nothing that being gay adds to society. Homosexuality and lesbianism has absolutely no positive affect on any society in which you find such activity.

You may attempt to say; “but there are many homosexuals and lesbians that have added greatly to society in the areas of art, science, and humanitarian pursuits (etc…) and I'd agree, BUT this isn’t BECAUSE they were homosexuals or lesbians, rather because they were PEOPLE.

In fact, the act that gives homosexuals and lesbians their title doesn’t even add to society; rather, it stunts society. The sexual proclivities that drive homosexuals and lesbians, does not, and cannot ever, result in procreation. In fact, in order for the homosexuals and lesbians to procreate, they must act (hypocritically) against that which they call their “nature”. But, biologically, their sexual proclivities act anathema to biological nature.

Another thing to ponder, is this: I will be called a “bigot” for making the above statements (which begs further questions because the definition for "bigot" relates to race not sexual prefrence), or I will be labeled “intolerant” for making the above statements (which begs further questions such as "isn't the hetreophobe being "intolerant" of my opinions?). But when one comes to the crux of the matter, all I have done is stated facts….

Ron, Evolution Fairytale Forum 59 Comments [11/20/2012 3:26:19 PM]
Fundie Index: 37
Submitted By: finnugold
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Frostythesnowman

Being an ignorant cretin adds nothing to society either Ron.

11/20/2012 3:37:12 PM



You're not a bigot you're just stupid.

11/20/2012 3:46:47 PM

Dr.Shrinker

I think it is important to note that there is absolutely nothing that being Christian adds to society. Christianity has absolutely no positive affect on any society in which you find such activity.

You may attempt to say; 'but there are many Christian that have added greatly to society in the areas of art, science, and humanitarian pursuits (etc…)' and I'd agree, BUT this isn’t BECAUSE they were Christians, rather because they were PEOPLE.

11/20/2012 3:58:34 PM

Leighton Buzzard

Doesn't have a negative effect, either, so, fuck off. Unless you're saying all people without children are worthless.

11/20/2012 4:00:51 PM

C_V


clue: procreation is not the be-all and end-all of our existance.

11/20/2012 4:02:45 PM

Dr.Shrinker

As for your second paragraph, speaking as a man who is infertile, I like to think I contribute a lot to society. I am a good partner to my wife. Together we have adopted three children. I have a productive job, I pay taxes, I vote my conscience. The fact that I cannot produce children has hardly kept me from being a good citizen. Your argument is laughably invalid.

With regards to your third paragraph, you have not stated facts. Rather you have used ad hoc reasoning in a very flimsy and superficial way to justify your petty, irrational prejudices. The fact that you are actively trying to suppress the rights and dignity of other people without a rational justification is what makes you, by definition, a bigot.

Hope that makes it clear.

11/20/2012 4:02:57 PM

Filin De Blanc

The existence of lesbians means that men like me who prefer spending time with women can have friends of our preferred gender that we can still talk about pretty girls. There you go, the existence of lesbians is a direct boon to my life.

11/20/2012 4:12:01 PM



Completely, completely wrong. For one, gay couples often take care of unwanted children in need of loving homes which I guarantee is more than you've probably ever contributed to society. Second, the merits of procreation are heavily debatable given how grossly overpopulated the planet is.

11/20/2012 4:22:15 PM

fishtank

The question that's begging the hardest is: why the fuck do you care?

11/20/2012 4:28:19 PM

Old Viking

... because they were PEOPLE.

Yep. You can stop tap dancing now, Ron.

11/20/2012 4:40:12 PM

Alencon

You could say the same thing about having blue eyes, being left handed, being black and so on and so forth.

So I guess you're admitting that being gay is just one of them things and there's no need to discriminate against them.

11/20/2012 5:00:26 PM

Felix Wilde

There you have it folks: Anything which stops more procreation is bad for society. Condoms are bad for society, despite having saved thousands of lives and prevented millions more lives which would have endured poverty and disenfranchisement. The pill is bad for society, despite resulting in more discovery of human sexuality and resulting in leaps forward in terms of sex and gender equality. Even abstinence, it follows, is bad for society! Who cares about your relationship status: get knocked up the duff now!

Dictionaries are descriptive, not prescriptive. Words like prejudice, politics, chauvinism, moot, and bus have changed meaning from their earlier definitions to various degrees. The word misogyny has recently had its dictionary definition changed* to reflect changes in usage. Because that's what dictionaries do. This isn't absolute, as different environments can use different definitions, and of course irony doesn't just mean "the state of anything out of the ordinary or strange to me", but... You. Are. Wrong.

Therefore "bigot" is just fine, you bigot. As for your next argument:

I think all people named Ron should be executed, immediately. If you disagree, that's intolerant. Please keep your ronicidophobic** comments to yourself.

See how it doesn't work to just shout "INTOLERANCE" back at everyone else? There's still a clear line in the sand. Disagreeing with someone's opinions is not intolerance. Judging someone as subhuman based solely on an arbitrary criterion is.

*I think it was the Macquarie Australian, but it may have even been the Queen of all dictionaries, the OED.
**What's the word for a portmanteau word derived from different root languages again? It is a done thing, and it's on the tip of my tongue...

11/20/2012 5:38:53 PM

Reynardine

Exactly. They contribute to society because they're people. Now, leave them the hell alone.

11/20/2012 6:14:59 PM

Papabear

Survival of a species isn't all about breeding as much and as quickly as possible.

Homosexuals provide extra food gatherers and cultivaters in lean times without adding more mouths to feed.

They might benefit societies by providing extra child care, which could increase child survival rates.

Additionally, homosexuals may provide different perspectives to issues. They may increase the pool of ideas which might benefit human survival.

Perhaps they are more likely to be artists, more likely to provide the music, dance and visual arts which make life WORTH living.

Use you head for something other than just a hat rack once in a while.

11/20/2012 6:37:29 PM

Fundies Make Me Sick

A bigot is someone who's extremely intolerant of ANY point of view, not just ones related to race, you moron.

11/20/2012 6:44:29 PM

Arctic Knight

"the definition for "bigot" relates to race not sexual prefrence"

big·ot [big-uht]
noun
a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion

Ron is demonstrably wrong.

11/20/2012 7:02:19 PM

Nagol

Wow, a bigot (yes, that's the correct term, read a dictionary) admitting that homosexuals are people, how sweet. Heterosexuality might make new babies Ron, but we have plenty of people, in case it escaped your notice. There are many other ways to contribute to society as well, like paying your taxes (gasp!), donating to charity, and adopting orphans. I'm willing to bet that most homosexuals have contributed more to society than you ever will. Now stop trying to make excuses for your irrational hatred of homosexuals and get over it. The world doesn't revolve around you.

11/20/2012 7:28:06 PM

farpadokly

Reduces the birth rate. Quite useful in an over-populated world.
"the act that gives homosexuals and lesbians their title". Homosexuality is just simply attraction towards members of one's own gender. It's not any specific act, just a state of attraction. Lesbians are homosexuals.
Bigot: "One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ." (freedictionary.com). Doesn't just relate to race.
I don't think the statements are particularly bigoted or intolerant. Just 1, wrong (homosexuality has no benefits; reduces birth rate) 2, obvious (individuals of the same gender can't procreate). You're allowed to have your opinions, but others are free to disagree with them. And how can I, as a heterosexual, be a "heterophobe"?
You have stated the obvious fact that individuals of the same gender can't reproduce. The other thing is just an opinion.








11/20/2012 7:37:52 PM

Darwin

"...BUT this isn’t BECAUSE they were homosexuals or lesbians, rather because they were PEOPLE."

You know, for those few seconds there you were doing really good. Really good. You just kind of, well, fucked up everything else around it.

11/20/2012 7:44:07 PM



Given the fact that the chance of a boy being gay increases according to the number of older brothers he has, and that the number of gay people has remained fairly steady, it's entirely possible that homosexuality is nature's poulation control.

11/20/2012 8:06:57 PM

Valerius

The first two paragraphs make sense, and I agree. However, homosexuality, in and of itself, has no negative effects on society either.

"In fact, the act that gives homosexuals and lesbians their title..."

WRONG! Homosexuals are defined by their attraction to members of the same sex, which is an inherent biological trait. Who they choose to have sex with, and what kind of sex they have is irrelevant. By the above logic, gay men from the sixties who remained deeply closeted, married women, and had children with them, would actually be straight.

"In fact, the act that gives homosexuals and lesbians their title doesn’t even add to society; rather, it stunts society. The sexual proclivities that drive homosexuals and lesbians, does not, and cannot ever, result in procreation."

The global human population is upwards of seven billion! How many more people do you want??? And the worth of any given society does not lie in how many babies its females can pump out. Go back to the middle ages if you think it is.

"But, biologically, their sexual proclivities act anathema to biological nature."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_animals_displaying_homosexual_behavior
More fail.

"isn't the hetreophobe [sic] being 'intolerant' of my opinions?"

No, your opinions are objectively, demonstrably wrong. Reality is not a matter of opinion.

"But when one comes to the crux of the matter, all I have done is stated facts lies…."

Fixed that for you.

11/20/2012 8:09:52 PM

Sylvana

If you can discount the good that homosexuals do by saying that they did it because they were people, you should just as easily be able to ignore their sexuality because at the end of the day all homosexuals are, are normal people living normal lives. If you bigots actually but out of their lives they may even be able to live love filled normal lives.

Heterosexuals and homosexuals are all just people and should all be treated equally.

11/20/2012 11:46:34 PM

J. James

So much for having sex outside the menstrual cycle or using condoms, then. Say farewell to jacking off, fellatio, and anal. Kiss the Pill goodbye. It's completely pointless, according to you...

11/20/2012 11:54:23 PM

Mihangel apYrs

uncles
aunts
secondary care givers of close blood links without their own dependants. It might just have given certain families/family groups the edge (e.g. a spare male not providing for his own progeny but for his sister's)

but that's too complex for a selfish arsehole to understand.

11/21/2012 12:03:28 AM

Angel

I actually understand this argument to a point, it's more logical to follow than most of the babble here, but then I would ask what positive affect does being heterosexual have? Other than the above mentioned procreation which is not necessary in a world of 7 billion people.

11/21/2012 12:33:31 AM
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