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Quote# 92086

As a philosophy, evolutionism has had proven evil influences on human happiness and welfare.

It is the root cause of such political philosophies as Atheism, Naturalism, Marxism, Statism, Socialism, and Nazism.

The 20th Century alone has spawned conflicts that have led to the loss of millions of lives. Darwin's theories are the root justification for such practices as racism, eugenics, abortion and euthanasia, practiced by Hitler, Stalin and Mao - all "intellectually fulfilled atheists" themselves.

Rev. Greg Haslam, BBC Religion & Ethics 51 Comments [1/15/2013 3:05:56 PM]
Fundie Index: 67
Submitted By: Atheissimo
WTF?! || meh
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So much fail, I don't even know where to start.

1/15/2013 3:11:38 PM

Creedence Leonore Gielgud


1/15/2013 3:15:33 PM

Fawful has seen God has a vagina on top of his penis

Marxism came before the theory of evolution and has nothing to do with it. Hitler, Stalin and Mao were not communists (those last two are actually oportunists and in my personal opinion, traitors) nor atheists for that matter (reference: http://www.infidels.eu/Violence). Eugenics (which both Hitler and to some extent Stalin believed) is the exact opposite of evolution and Darwin's books were banned both in Stalinist USSR and Nazi Germany. As a future historian and trotskyist I find this offensive. Then again, I'm not new here, so what the hell.

Oh, and finally, evolutionism is not a philosophy, has never been nor will ever be. That's just some bullshit strawman you pulled out of your ass (I can see what he means by it, but only people like him believe in such nonsense). The only thing he was right was with evolution being linked with Naturalism (the literary movement), although this came much later.

1/15/2013 3:20:29 PM

Wehpudicabok

The shit you people say...

There is no such philosophy as "evolutionism." There is no such thing! Evolution is a scientific principle, nothing more.

I will grant you that evolution, as a scientific explanation for natural phenomena, has been influential in some philosophical thought. Atheism and naturalism both predate the modern theory of evolution, but it is true that the positions are now more plausible since we can't say "well obviously God was responsible for creating these amazing things called 'humans,' and 'horses,' and 'cockroaches.' "

But the rest of those have nothing to do with evolution! Marxism was a response to the subjugation of the lower class under the Industrial Revolution. Socialism evolved out of that. Nazism is just the most racist form of fascism with a socialist cover story, and "statism" is just a vague term for political ideologies that grant the government more powers than most. None of these has anything to do with evolution in any way!

"Darwin's theories are the root justification for such practices as racism, eugenics, abortion and euthanasia"

Racism, abortion and euthanasia have existed for millennia! Do you honestly not know that? Do you think there was no racism before Darwin? If so you are a moron beyond redemption. And eugenics was based on a misinterpretation of evolution. If we subscribe to evolution as it actually exists, then the "bad genes" in our society will disappear automatically, without us doing anything about it. That's what natural selection is. If we're doing something about it (i.e. eugenics) it isn't natural! That's like shooting down a plane and then saying you were "upholding gravity."

Lastly, Hitler was not an atheist but a Catholic, and while Stalin and Mao were indeed atheists, the reason they committed these atrocities is because they were insane and power-hungry, not irreligious.

1/15/2013 3:36:58 PM

Wehpudicabok

Oh, and another thing. The Communist Manifesto predates On the Origin of Species by a full decade. If Marx was influenced by Darwin, he must also be a time-traveler! That or you're just full of shit and can't be bothered to do TEN FUCKING SECONDS OF RESEARCH!

I am pissed off; can anyone tell?!?

1/15/2013 3:39:53 PM

Vesus

@ Wehpudicabok

It's not that this guy can't do ten seconds of research, (although I'm sure he has no interest in the veracity of his own claims) it's that he knows his gullible flock will NEVER be bothered to check whether any of his spewed nonsense is true.

1/15/2013 3:54:40 PM

Fawful has seen God has a vagina on top of his penis

@Wehpudicabok


1/15/2013 4:14:25 PM

Fawful has seen God has a vagina on top of his penis

Double post.

1/15/2013 4:15:21 PM

Rabbit of Caerbannog

Evolution isn't a philosophy, dipshit.

And no, it is not the "root cause" of atheism (which existed long before the ToE was developed), Naturalism, Statism (which is not a philosophy but rather a descriptor for overly large and powerful governments), Socialism or Nazism.

And Hitler wasn't an atheist.

1/15/2013 4:17:38 PM

Papabear

"As a philosophy, evolutionism has had proven evil influences on human happiness and welfare."

What the heck is "evolutionism?" As a philosophy the ToE fails utterly because IT IS NOT A PHILOSOPHY!

"It is the root cause of such political philosophies as Atheism, Naturalism, Marxism, Statism, Socialism, and Nazism."

Atheism pre-dates every other ism as everyone is born an atheist.

Naturalism? Believing in nature? Isn't that the ism your lot like so much when talking about how un-natural homosexuality is?

Statism? What the heck is that?

Marxism pre-dates the ToE. And, Marxism, socialism and Nazism have nothing to do with the ToE.


"The 20th Century alone has spawned conflicts that have led to the loss of millions of lives. Darwin's theories are the root justification for such practices as racism, eugenics, abortion and euthanasia, practiced by Hitler, Stalin and Mao - all "intellectually fulfilled atheists" themselves."

Uh, no. Racism is tribalism run amok, nothing related to the ToE.

Eugenics is humans trying to take the place of natural selection. Related to evolution but not advocated by anyone how understands how poor many human selections can be.

Abortion and euthanasia are not practiced as some expression of the ToE. That Hitler or others used abortion and eutanasia against their political enemies doesn't make the ToE at fault for their actions.

P.S. Hitler was a Christian. And, how do you know that Stalin and/or Mao were "intellectually fulfilled?"



1/15/2013 4:32:24 PM

Nomen Nescio

atheistic philosophy --- as a deliberate, purposeful thing --- dates back to ancient greece, at the very least. though it's been independently (re)invented plenty of times in other cultures, too.

evolutionary biology dates to the 1860's. and was not either a cause OR an effect of atheistic thinking.

1/15/2013 5:28:51 PM

D Laurier

As a philosophy, evolutionism still does not exist.

Despite the fact that atheism dates back to the dawn of human civilization, naturalism is the study of nature, marxism is an economic model, and the rest have been found to exist despite your "evolutioism" still not existing.

Except that Darwin's one and only theory cannot be used to justify racim, eugenics, abortion or euthanasia. Hitler was a christian, and there seems to be nothing to suggest that either Stalin or Mao were "intelectualy fulfilled".
Nor were any of them medical doctors, o no, they did not practice abortion. Indeed Hitler himself forced strict laws forbiding abortion.
Mao and Stalin both rejected the notion of "race", and so could not practice" racism.
Hitler approved of eugenic policys, but so did Churchill, Rosevelt, and DuGaul.

Care to try again.

1/15/2013 5:46:18 PM

Alencon

What a mess. Let's just do a list:

1. Evolution is not a philosophy
2. Evolution has no "proven" evil influences on anything
3. Evolution is not the "root cause" of Atheism. Disbelief in a diety is the root cause.
4. Evolution is not the "root cause" of Naturalism. Empirical observation is the root cause.
5. Evolution is not the "root cause" of Marxism. Indistrialization is the root cause.
6. Evolution is not the "root cause" of Socialism. Economic inequality is the root cause.
7. Evolution is not the "root cause" of Nazism. Nationalism is the root cause.
8. Hitler was not an Atheist. He was a Roman Catholic Christian.
9. Darwin's theory, not theories, have nothing to do with racism, eugenics, abortion or euthanasia as practiced by anyone. And, even if it did, that has no effect upon whether the Theory of Evolution is correct or not (simple evolution, descent with modification, is an observable fact).
10. Rev. Greg Haslam is a moron.

1/15/2013 5:46:50 PM

John

Darwin's theories are the root justification for such practices as racism, eugenics, abortion and euthanasia, practiced by Hitler, Stalin and Mao

Just like Newton's theory of gravity was the root justification for the V-2 rockets Hitler dropped on London.

1/15/2013 5:57:50 PM



As a philosophy, evolutionism doesn't exist.

It is sometimes blamed for several movements which actually predate it, including Atheism, Naturalism, Statism, and Socialism, and others which have no causal relationship with it, such as Marxism and Nazism. The fact that the USSR and NSDAP both banned Darwin's work is no impediment to this.

Darwin is also blamed for practices which predate him such as racism, abortion, eugenics and euthanasia. These were practiced by people who denied the validity of his ideas, such as Hitler, Stalin and Mao, so there is obviously no connection; however, we do observe from this that denial of valid science is embraced by totalitarians.

1/15/2013 6:12:32 PM

Fawful has seen God has a vagina on top of his penis

@D Laurier:

*DeGaulle

Also, Hitler did in fact approve of abortion. What he did was forbid any kind of abortion on people because no human being deserved it (remeber jews are not people according to him, so it's logical why he allowed it to be practiced on them). And Stalin was an anti-semite too.

1/15/2013 6:53:45 PM

Sasha

Modern conflicts kill millions of people because (a) millions of people are alive today thanks to science like evolutionary biology, and (b) our weapons are much more lethal.

The only way in which evolution has spawned modern conflicts is that the human race has not evolved sufficiently to share this planet in peace.

1/15/2013 6:56:54 PM

anevilmeme

This is the problem with a religious worldview, the fundtards can't see the world thru any prism but their own. Evolutionary biology is a science not a philosophy, but no matter how many times you tell them they can't accept it.

Nor apparently can they accept history. Atheism, Naturalism, Marxism, Statism and Socialism all predate Darwin's work and the Nazis weren't big fans of his work.


1/15/2013 7:45:53 PM

Sam

The only way you can say that evolution is the "root cause" of these wildly disparate philosophies is that they were all created by humans, who came about through evolution.

So, thanks, reverend, for at least abandoning creationism!

1/15/2013 7:59:38 PM



abortion and racism predate Darwin by many many centuries. The concept of a master race was common of many religions (God loves us best) and was a frequent occurance in the old testament of the bible.

Hitler was a christian doing Gods work by his own writings. Got mit uns on nazi belt buckles for example.


1/15/2013 8:27:10 PM

freako104

Reverend, do yourself a favour. Shut up. The shit you spewed is amongst the stupidest I have ever seen. I'd call you a moron but I'd be insulting the intelligence of morons. Learn history, philosophy and science. You sir need a basic 6th grade education as these "facts" could be destroyed by a high school student. If you spewed this in a college science class you'd be laughed out and fail the whole class. And that's not goung into your other failures.

1/15/2013 8:54:35 PM

checkmate

As a philosophy, physics has had proven evil influences on human happiness and welfare.

It is the root cause of such political philosophies as Atheism, Naturalism, Marxism, Statism, Socialism, and Nazism.

...


Or:

As a philosophy, biology has had proven evil influences on human happiness and welfare.

It is the root cause of such political philosophies as Atheism, Naturalism, Marxism, Statism, Socialism, and Nazism.

...

1/15/2013 9:03:28 PM

Reckoner

Facepalm within the first three words. That's gotta be a record.

1/15/2013 9:30:39 PM



i see not even the BBC is immune

1/15/2013 10:55:20 PM

Wehpudicabok

Wow, I got kinda crazy there... *sweat drop* Thanks for your understanding guys.

@Papabear:

I doubt the OP even has this distinction in mind, but "naturalism" actually refers to the idea that only natural causes exist - that is, it's the denial of the supernatural. All naturalists are atheists, but not all atheists are naturalists (you could believe in ghosts but not God, for example).

1/16/2013 12:41:38 AM
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